In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
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Any Economists??
Quote by Geordiecpl2001
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
There was never a pile of money as in notes, it is all figures as in debits and credits
Look towards the middle east and china and you may have your answer.
Quote by Geordiecpl2001
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
1) China.....although Governments borrow from many sources, including me and you.
2) Subtract the cost of bailing out the banks from the total Government Debt and you have your answer.
Quote by Max777
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
1) China.....although Governments borrow from many sources, including me and you.
2) Subtract the cost of bailing out the banks from the total Government Debtand you have your answer.
and factor in the interest that's being added every single day....
Quote by Geordiecpl2001
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
the first question is extremely relevent, the second is superfluous. the money/credit, never existed. it was created out of thin air. research money as debt.
i wish to change your question a little if i may be so rude.
1, if this country, most of europe, latin america, japan, africa and north america have such huge debts and governments can get central banks to PRINT money (inflation of the money supply), then who the phuck do we owe it to ? its a fuckin scam !
Quote by gulsonroad30664
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
the first question is extremely relevent, the second is superfluous. the money/credit, never existed. it was created out of thin air. research money as debt.
i wish to change your question a little if i may be so rude.
1, if this country, most of europe, latin america, japan, africa and north america have such huge debts and governments can get central banks to PRINT money (inflation of the money supply), then who the phuck do we owe it to ? its a fuckin scam !
The debt is real it was all issued in Uk Bonds which are held mostly in the Middle East and China and by institutions in the UK.
We could just print more money but it would cause massive inflation because the pound would collapse.
The interest alone on the bonds means the treasury have to issue more bonds just the pay this.
The risk is people would stop buying UK Bonds and where would we get any money then?
This almost happened under Labour as the bonds were going to be downgraded, this is what happened in Greece and look at the state they are in.
So there are two solutions
1. payoff the debt creating more deposite and risk inflation
2. A mix of cutting spending, raising taxes to pay it off over many years.
Either way = PAYING
Sex God
*Snip*
I thought that was called quantitive easing
Quote by Theladyisaminx
We could just print more money
I thought that was called quantitive easing
Quote by Theladyisaminx
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
the first question is extremely relevent, the second is superfluous. the money/credit, never existed. it was created out of thin air. research money as debt.
i wish to change your question a little if i may be so rude.
1, if this country, most of europe, latin america, japan, africa and north america have such huge debts and governments can get central banks to PRINT money (inflation of the money supply), then who the phuck do we owe it to ? its a fuckin scam !
The debt is real it was all issued in Uk Bonds which are held mostly in the Middle East and China and by institutions in the UK.
We could just print more money but it would cause massive inflation because the pound would collapse.
The interest alone on the bonds means the treasury have to issue more bonds just the pay this.
The risk is people would stop buying UK Bonds and where would we get any money then?
This almost happened under Labour as the bonds were going to be downgraded, this is what happened in Greece and look at the state they are in.
So there are two solutions
1. payoff the debt creating more deposite and risk inflation
2. A mix of cutting spending, raising taxes to pay it off over many years.
Either way = PAYINGthe debt is NOT real, it was created out of thin air by banks at fractional reserve and whatever money is owed to whom is owed by the banks to one another !
1. pay off the debt creating more deposite and risk inflation ? poppycock ! INFLATION/DEBASEMENT OF THE CURRENCY is caused by an increase in the money supply ! PRINTING IT !
2. a mix of cutting spending, raising taxes to pay it off over many years ? RUBBISH, it can never be paid off and is never intended to be ! if the government cuts spending and raises taxes in an economic enviroment where lenders are not and cannot lend (to top up the money supply in circulation), demand will fall causing depression. when the private bank of england carried out quantatative easing to the tune of £200 billion (digitised or printed), it did so out of thin air ! and gave it to banks to fill balance sheets that were full of toxic debt. this credit, printed out of thin air, AT INTEREST, was assigned as debt, AT INTEREST, to the british tax payer !
this credit, AT INTEREST, never previously existed. this is the great fraud being carried out by private central banks around the world commited against the people of the world causing private debt to be socialised and passed on to the tax payers of the world.
governments (tax payers) are then ripped off again, not having sufficient funds in reserve, are forced again to raise funds on the international money markets, to sell/auction, bonds, gilts, treasuries etc and raise taxes and sell state assets/privatisation, AT INTEREST, to pay the debt.
having staved off bankruptcy and collapse temporarily by socialising their debt, the bankers can now pay themselves record bonuses from the sweat of the tax payers. the tax payers can suffer austerity and lose all their assets while the bankers enjoy plenty and think of the next big scam/ponzi scheme to rob us all.
Quote by gulsonroad30664
the debt is NOT real, it was created out of thin air by banks at fractional reserve and whatever money is owed to whom is owed by the banks to one another !
1. pay off the debt creating more deposite and risk inflation ? poppycock ! INFLATION/DEBASEMENT OF THE CURRENCY is caused by an increase in the money supply ! PRINTING IT !
2. a mix of cutting spending, raising taxes to pay it off over many years ? RUBBISH, it can never be paid off and is never intended to be ! if the government cuts spending and raises taxes in an economic enviroment where lenders are not and cannot lend (to top up the money supply in circulation), demand will fall causing depression. when the private bank of england carried out quantatative easing to the tune of £200 billion (digitised or printed), it did so out of thin air ! and gave it to banks to fill balance sheets that were full of toxic debt. this credit, printed out of thin air, AT INTEREST, was assigned as debt, AT INTEREST, to the british tax payer !
this credit, AT INTEREST, never previously existed. this is the great fraud being carried out by private central banks around the world commited against the people of the world causing private debt to be socialised and passed on to the tax payers of the world.
governments (tax payers) are then ripped off again, not having sufficient funds in reserve, are forced again to raise funds on the international money markets, to sell/auction, bonds, gilts, treasuries etc and raise taxes and sell state assets/privatisation, AT INTEREST, to pay the debt.
having staved off bankruptcy and collapse temporarily by socialising their debt, the bankers can now pay themselves record bonuses from the sweat of the tax payers. the tax payers can suffer austerity and lose all their assets while the bankers enjoy plenty and think of the next big scam/ponzi scheme to rob us all.
Gulson,
Get yourself off on a basic bookkeeping course and you will find that for every debit, there is a corresponding credit.
Central banks of all countries, on occasion, increase the money supply. The QE under the last government was not an isolated incident.
You continually overlook the fact that the government actually owns 84% of RBS and 40odd% of Lloyds, so in time will see some return on the monies poured into the banks.
Instead of continually criticising what has already happened, why not tell us how you would rectify the current situation..........after all, you are the one with your eyes open!
Quote by Max777
Gulson,
Get yourself off on a basic bookkeeping course and you will find that for every debit, there is a corresponding credit.
This guy tried to rewrite those basic bookkeeping principles...
and failed miserably too.
and was a Labour MP
Funny how they always seem to get it wrong.
"From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
In British politics and economics, Black Wednesday refers to the events of 16 September 1992 when the Conservative governmentwas forced to withdraw the pound sterling from the European Exchange Rate Mechanism (ERM) after they were unable to keep sterling above its agreed lower limit. George Soros, the most high profile of the currency market investors, made over US$1 billion profit by short selling sterling.
In 1997 the UK Treasury estimated the cost of Black Wednesday at £3.4 billion, with the actual cost being £3.3 billionwhich was revealed in 2005 under the Freedom of Information Act (FoI).
The trading losses in August and September were estimated at £800m, but the main loss to taxpayers arose because the devaluation could have made them a profit. The papers show that if the government had maintained $24bn foreign currency reserves and the pound had fallen by the same amount, the UK would have made a profit on sterling's devaluation. Newspapers also revealed that the Treasury spent £27bn of reserves in propping up the pound."
now let me get this right.....oh yes it was Nigel lawson ( A TORY ) that cost us £3.3 billion pounds in a day !!! What did we get for our £3.3 billion...er..thats right nothing. Not one building...not one extra service....not a bean. Now thats what I call failing miserably.
Lets remember..people from all parties can get it wrong !!!!!!!
In British politics and economics, Black Wednesday refers to the events of 16 September 1992 when the Conservative governmentwas forced to withdraw the pound sterling from the European Exchange Rate Mechanism (ERM) after they were unable to keep sterling above its agreed lower limit. George Soros, the most high profile of the currency market investors, made over US$1 billion profit by short selling sterling.
In 1997 the UK Treasury estimated the cost of Black Wednesday at £3.4 billion, with the actual cost being £3.3 billionwhich was revealed in 2005 under the Freedom of Information Act (FoI).
The trading losses in August and September were estimated at £800m, but the main loss to taxpayers arose because the devaluation could have made them a profit. The papers show that if the government had maintained $24bn foreign currency reserves and the pound had fallen by the same amount, the UK would have made a profit on sterling's devaluation. Newspapers also revealed that the Treasury spent £27bn of reserves in propping up the pound."
now let me get this right.....oh yes it was Nigel lawson ( A TORY ) that cost us £3.3 billion pounds in a day !!! What did we get for our £3.3 billion...er..thats right nothing. Not one building...not one extra service....not a bean. Now thats what I call failing miserably.
Lets remember..people from all parties can get it wrong !!!!!!!
Quote by deancannock
"From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
In British politics and economics, Black Wednesday refers to the events of 16 September 1992 when the Conservative government was forced to withdraw the pound sterling from the European Exchange Rate Mechanism (ERM) after they were unable to keep sterling above its agreed lower limit. George Soros, the most high profile of the currency market investors, made over US$1 billion profit by short selling sterling.
In 1997 the UK Treasury estimated the cost of Black Wednesday at £3.4 billion, with the actual cost being £3.3 billion which was revealed in 2005 under the Freedom of Information Act (FoI).
The trading losses in August and September were estimated at £800m, but the main loss to taxpayers arose because the devaluation could have made them a profit. The papers show that if the government had maintained $24bn foreign currency reserves and the pound had fallen by the same amount, the UK would have made a profit on sterling's devaluation. Newspapers also revealed that the Treasury spent £27bn of reserves in propping up the pound."
now let me get this right.....oh yes it was Nigel lawson ( A TORY ) that cost us £3.3 billion pounds in a day !!! What did we get for our £3.3 billion...er..thats right nothing. Not one building...not one extra service....not a bean. Now thats what I call failing miserably.
Lets remember..people from all parties can get it wrong !!!!!!!
But, you have to remember.... although it was the Tories 4th win in succession, they were still mopping up the mess left by the previous Labour administration!
Still... look on the bright side, it buried the prospect of the Euro for the UK and that's not all bad. is it?
Quote by Islandcpl1
In a lot of the threads in here there are claim and counter claim about how much the previous Labour Gov. spent, or overspent, and the resulting huge dept now owed by this Country.
So a couple of questions, hopefully some clever people on here can answer them;
1, If this Country and most of Europe and America have such huge debts, who was rich enough to lend us / them those massive amounts of money.
2, How big would the UK debt have been / what would be the state of the nations finances, if the banking crisis hadn't happened. ie if the bankers had got it right instead of getting it wrong and needing umpteen billions to bail them out.
John
There was never a pile of money as in notes, it is all figures as in debits and credits
Look towards the middle east and china and you may have your answer.
I'm curious to know if you can qualify your statement, without quoting a paper as source!
I have never quoted a paper as source of what I write. If you look at my next post I think I explained all there.
BTW I am not a Economist either.
