Join the most popular community of UK swingers now
Login

Ban on sale of fireworks?

last reply
75 replies
3.2k views
0 watchers
0 likes
Quote by Ben_Minx
Did you know the latest statistics (ROSPA) indicate that 30,000 children aged 0-4 are injured in burn/scald accidents in the UK in a year? And only about 7 of them involved fireworks?
I think hot beverages should be banned in any home with toddlers.
Now stop pretending this is an elf n saferty issue.

some might argue that 1 is too many when it can be prevented
Quote by MidsCouple24
And that is where the problem arises, what is an organised event ? who is going to decide what is an organised event, the Council, do they have the resources to look into every application ? pubs, clubs, Boy Scouts group, old folks homes, childrens hospitals, fire brigade are organisations I have seen put on events, which is capable which isn't, they would need to look at each one individually because if they follow the regulations with adequate safety precautions there is no reason why any of them should not be granted a licence and no reason why any of them should be just because they are the Fire Brigade or Boy Scouts, all need the right staff trained in the right way, it's not enough to be capable of putting out a fire it's the ability to prevent one in the first place, they need a co-ordinater trained in pyrotechnics, St Johns Ambulance in sufficient numbers for those attending, designated emergency areas and much more. You say a pub cannot put on an organised event, yet with those implementations made they actually could

An organised event is an event put on by the local borough council, for the benefit of their residents. We have three such displays around here all run and regulated by the local council. Surely Mids even you can see that is a better way of watching fireworks? The other way is what we have now where children over 500 every year are seriously injured by fireworks. I do not have figures Mids, but I would bet that not a single child is injured at a properly council run display.
So simple really. Leave things as they are with kids letting them off on the streets, scaring the elderly and animals weeks before the event. Having children injured every year through fireworks and am sure some are blinded or lose fingers etc or............ only have council run displays for the residents in a safe and controlled enviroment where the safety of people watching is paramount?
Which one is it then Mids?
Quote by starlightcouple

I'd ban fireworks but I think the practicalities of doing so would just drive an underground market to prominence. A bit like firearms actually. They're all but banned (except to licensed people) but still frighteningly available in quantity if you know where to get them.

An underground market? Why? For what purpose? This problem with regards to the letting off of fireworks on our streets sometimes weeks before the event, is invariably done by adolescents. Are you telling me that there will be an underground network of people selling fireworks to children in some underground marketing ploy? What really?
If they are banned people will after a couple of years do one of two things. Either don't bother with any fireworks or go to a display. Your Mr Average family is not going to go to a secret location to buy underhanded fireworks illegally. I have not heard anything so silly since well.....Ben's comments. :grin:
And firearms? Drugs? Contraband alcohol? Contraband cigarettes?
Your reasoning doesn't hold water star.
Quote by GnV

I'd ban fireworks but I think the practicalities of doing so would just drive an underground market to prominence. A bit like firearms actually. They're all but banned (except to licensed people) but still frighteningly available in quantity if you know where to get them.

An underground market? Why? For what purpose? This problem with regards to the letting off of fireworks on our streets sometimes weeks before the event, is invariably done by adolescents. Are you telling me that there will be an underground network of people selling fireworks to children in some underground marketing ploy? What really?
If they are banned people will after a couple of years do one of two things. Either don't bother with any fireworks or go to a display. Your Mr Average family is not going to go to a secret location to buy underhanded fireworks illegally. I have not heard anything so silly since well.....Ben's comments. :grin:
And firearms? Drugs? Contraband alcohol? Contraband cigarettes?
Your reasoning doesn't hold water star
.
Simply put GnV we are talking about a once in a year occasion that lasts for about two weeks. It causes distress to many people and animals. A quick fix solution for that is there for all to see. The other examples you give are not even in the same debate. Millions and millions of people use drugs, smoke or drink. This activity is an all round year thing, fireworks happens once a year.
So really then GnV why not just make everything available to all at the local sweet shop and be damned with any consequences. :doh: What a weak argument to use by using others examples that frankly hold not an ounce of water with regards to the selling and letting off of fireworks.
I am suprised at you GnV as I thought your debating tactics were always well thought out, lately I think you have been answering after an afternoon nap and still half asleep. :bounce:
Quote by star
fireworks happens once a year.

Tosh.
Weddings, birthdays, New Year's Eve. The list goes on. All the year round there are celebrations which involve fireworks.
Bonfire Night may only be once a year but the use of fireworks and their availability spans the year.
Quote by flower411
I seem to remember that many moons ago fireworks were not so widely available and certainly weren`t on sale for such a long period of time around November 5th.
So when we went on school trips to France we always made a point of buying fireworks, where they were widely available........... and flick knives as it happens lol
So if we are going to ban fireworks here we should probably make sure they are banned in Europe as well ...... maybe a nice little job for the European courts :lol:

I seem to remember both 'Crow Scarers', Ammonium Nitrate and Sodium Clorate all available for a reasonable price at any good farming supply shop.
Best fire works displays................ mmmmmmmmmmmmm
To be honest we just take the lanes up the hill behind us towards Buxton for about 1 mile, park up with loads of others and watch across the Cheshire Plain or towards Manchester and have a good couple of hours watching various displays or back garden affairs............plus marvel at the nerves of all the pilots coming in to land at Manchester airport amongst all those potential flying hazards.
Great fun on a clear night and a great party atmosphere amongst all the locals who congregate to watch as well.
granted if you want to get all Official, then remember, remember (not the 5th of November), but the Fireworks Act 2003. Just some snippets for you all
:arrow: Penalty notices for disorder offences - Upper Tier Penalty - £80 for 16 year olds and over (£40 for 10-15 year olds) under tha above Act.
:arrow: There's also the Breach of fireworks curfew ( 11pm-7am), a 'recordable offense', covered by Fireworks Regulations 2004 under s11 of the Fireworks Act 2003.
:arrow: Possession by a person under 18 of an adult firework), a 'recordable offense', covered by Fireworks Regulations 2004 under s11 of the Fireworks Act 2003.
There's also a whole raft of offences covered by The Explosive Substances Act 1883 which 'over laps' with aspects of all the above as well as the more obvious 'terrorism' connatations - afterall most of the larger fireworks are classified as 'explosives'.
Then you can also look at.....
Offences Against the Person Act 1861 - Section 28 of the 1861 Act makes it an offence for any person to cause grievous bodily harm by the unlawful explosion of gunpowder or other explosive substance. Section 29 of the1861 Act makes it an offence to unlawfully cause gunpowder or some other explosive substance to explode with intent to cause grievous bodily harm. And Section 30 of the 1861 Act makes it an offence to place explosives near buildings or ships with intent to do grievous bodily harm.
The Explosives Act 1875 - Section 23 of the 1875 Act makes it an offence to fail to take all reasonable precautions to prevent access to explosives. Section 30 of the 1875 Act makes it an offence to sell gunpowder on the highway or in a public place. Section 31 of the 1875 Act makes it an offence to sell gunpowder to children apparently under 16. Section 80 of the 1875 Act makes it an offence to throw fireworks on the highway or in a public place (Note: Where the term "gunpowder" is used section 39 of the Act makes that term applicable to all other explosives covered by the Act)
Criminal Damage Act 1971 - Section 1 of the 1971 Act may be the appropriate offence where a minor explosion causes damage. An example of when such a decision can properly be taken is where an offender detonates explosives in a spirit of reckless curiosity, without the intent necessary for more serious offences. If damage to property occurs as a result of combustion of an article the appropriate charge may be one of arson, with or without intent to endanger life.
and that's just some of the usual ones. Keep looking and you can find an awful lot more detail
Time out, the pair of you. I have locked this and if I remember, I will unlock before I go for a bath later, when hopefully you will have had time to calm down.
Please remember, this may not be the CA forum, but the rules are still the same, and that still includes not going out of your way to insult each other.
If you have a problem, PM me, but for goodness sake, stop all the bickering. If you cant discuss nicely, leave it to those who can and stop all the personal digs all the time!
On with the discussion.
There's a lot to be said for an organised firework display, its certainly going to be a lot more impressive than buying a box of fireworks.

However, I'd have to say that I really enjoy letting them off in my garden, its fun and with the proper precautions its reasonably safe, there's no doubt that fireworks are dangerous though, the recent shows that even at organised displays things can go wrong, you have to wonder if these people had the relevant training.
i think they should only be allowed to be let off on one day only
pets/old people and a few others to mention all become stressed by the constant noise and the week or so it all goes on for
and by the way, nicely cleaned up :thumbup:
Fun/Neil I take your points.
My source is the 2004 ROSPA accident analysis.
You both infer, the "accidents" are in the main preventable incidents caused by irresponsibility.
I see no reason to ban anything based on the moronic behaviour of a few.
i think banned is being confused with regulated cool
They are heavily regulated.
Quote by Ben_Minx
I see no reason to ban anything based on the moronic behaviour of a few.

Here here - well said. Could not believe what I was reading. Why is there always an outcry to "ban" something or other - just because it upsets the sensitivities of people who grow old before their time.
Lighten up. (the sky with Standard fireworks) ho ho ho
Quote by Ben_Minx
They are heavily regulated.

purely perspective wink
Quote by Too Hot

I see no reason to ban anything based on the moronic behaviour of a few.

Here here - well said. Could not believe what I was reading. Why is there always an outcry to "ban" something or other - just because it upsets the sensitivities of people who grow old before their time.
Lighten up. (the sky with Standard fireworks) ho ho ho
I'd agree TH if people who are injured by these explosive devices are made to pay for their treatment and not get it free on the NHS. May make more resources available then for us early retirees.....
Quote by Ben_Minx
I see no reason to ban anything based on the moronic behaviour of a few.

It's not 'a few' though, is it Ben. Maybe where you live but here the 'few' would be those responsible adults who for one or two nights a year use fireworks as they're intended to be used. The many would be the cunts who disturb the peace for weeks and weeks on end, reducing pets to quivering wrecks who won't even set foot in the garden once it's dark for a quick piss cos they're terrified, sometimes to the point of needing Valium FFS. As a libertarian by default don't think I don't see the irony here in me calling for a ban on general public sale but this heavy regulation you're talking about doesn't work, does it, else this wouldn't happen year in, year out.
Quote by Too Hot

I see no reason to ban anything based on the moronic behaviour of a few.

Here here - well said. Could not believe what I was reading. Why is there always an outcry to "ban" something or other - just because it upsets the sensitivities of people who grow old before their time.
Lighten up. (the sky with Standard fireworks) ho ho ho
I am never the kind of person that wants to see things banned at the drop of a hat. But come on Too Hot there are over 500 children injured every year from the miss use of fireworks. Of course fireworks are regulated but not heavily enough in my opinion.
The problems are many and I think that selling to the public where they then fall into the hands of minors to terrorise the elderly and in particular animals weeks before firework night surely cannot be right and proper responsibility?
If for no other reason, what about the injuries they cause because of poor supervision? Weeks of annoyance and remember you are supposed to be 18 to buy fireworks, so on that basis the law is also being broken as kids as young as ten are found in possession and letting them off. This is not about banning for banning sake, this is about preventing many things and the most important is serious injury to children. How can anyone be against that?
I admit we have very few public order problems.
I can appreciate the problems of city living, it hasn't been that long.
I don't know what the solution is to such nuisance but would favour the enforcement of existing regulations.
Quote by Ben_Minx
I admit we have very few public order problems.
I can appreciate the problems of city living, it hasn't been that long.
I don't know what the solution is to such nuisance but would favour the enforcement of existing regulations.

That legislation is 8 years old in a fast moving scenario.
The welsh sheep have always been known for their durability :grin:

A typical example that happens up and down the country.
As star said earlier, why do the UK public persist in celebrating a terrorist act against the British Parliament and the Monarch of the time after having spent so much celebrating a Diamond Jubilee of the present monarch?
This must be most confusing to many.
Quote by GnV
As star said earlier, why do the UK public persist in celebrating a terrorist act against the British Parliament and the Monarch of the time after having spent so much celebrating a Diamond Jubilee of the present monarch?
This must be most confusing to many.

I think the celebration is the failure of the plot. It's Guy on the bonfire, not King James.
Quote by starlightcouple
This is not about banning for banning sake, this is about preventing many things and the most important is serious injury to children. How can anyone be against that?

Absolutely..........so where is the parental responsibility? It is not the law or the act of setting off type 1 or 2 fireworks that is the problem. It is parental or personal responsibility that is the main factor in most of the accidents involving fireworks. Individuals need to take responsibilty for their own actions.
Dave_Notts
Quote by Dave__Notts
This is not about banning for banning sake, this is about preventing many things and the most important is serious injury to children. How can anyone be against that?

Absolutely..........so where is the parental responsibility? It is not the law or the act of setting off type 1 or 2 fireworks that is the problem. It is parental or personal responsibility that is the main factor in most of the accidents involving fireworks. Individuals need to take responsibilty for their own actions.
Dave_Notts
But there lies the problem....
They don't......Never have.....Never will.....
They are content to keep acting the way they do and no amount of heavy regulation will ever stop them...
Quote by neilinleeds
I see no reason to ban anything based on the moronic behaviour of a few.

It's not 'a few' though, is it Ben. Maybe where you live but here the 'few' would be those responsible adults who for one or two nights a year use fireworks as they're intended to be used. The many would be the cunts who disturb the peace for weeks and weeks on end, reducing pets to quivering wrecks who won't even set foot in the garden once it's dark for a quick piss cos they're terrified, sometimes to the point of needing Valium FFS. As a libertarian by default don't think I don't see the irony here in me calling for a ban on general public sale but this heavy regulation you're talking about doesn't work, does it, else this wouldn't happen year in, year out.
:thumbup:
Quote by northwest-cpl
As star said earlier, why do the UK public persist in celebrating a terrorist act against the British Parliament and the Monarch of the time after having spent so much celebrating a Diamond Jubilee of the present monarch?
This must be most confusing to many.

I think the celebration is the failure of the plot. It's Guy on the bonfire, not King James.
Where do the fireworks come in then?
Quote by Dave__Notts
This is not about banning for banning sake, this is about preventing many things and the most important is serious injury to children. How can anyone be against that?

Absolutely..........so where is the parental responsibility? It is not the law or the act of setting off type 1 or 2 fireworks that is the problem. It is parental or personal responsibility that is the main factor in most of the accidents involving fireworks. Individuals need to take responsibilty for their own actions.
Dave_Notts
The days of general parental responsibility it would seem are long gone. In this instance it does not even have to be a childs parent, it is probably an ' adult ' walking past a shop and the kids ask that ' adult ' to buy them. The adult could be a person who is only just 18. That adult could well be that kids older Brother or a friends older Brother. The point is they manage to get hold of the fireworks.
Of course parents can also show some degree of responsibility, but on many occasions the parents themselves have not got a clue what their kids are up to. Does any parent know what their 13 year old child is doing 24 hours a day? Not many do and I cannot see why any person would not agree that the instances of children maiming themselves for life through fireworks should be taken away, by banning the sale of fireworks to anyone that does not hold a current license issued by the local authority. It would be such an easy thing to do as well.
Only last night a neighbour was letting off fireworks in a garden so small, and kids were standing around watching. The kids may just have well been playing on the edge of a busy road. Maybe people should have a safety awareness course before buying fireworks as people like my neighbour obviously has not got a clue about safety, and not a clue about the dangers of fireworks that can so easily go wrong.
Quote by GnV
As star said earlier, why do the UK public persist in celebrating a terrorist act against the British Parliament and the Monarch of the time after having spent so much celebrating a Diamond Jubilee of the present monarch?
This must be most confusing to many.

I think the celebration is the failure of the plot. It's Guy on the bonfire, not King James.
Where do the fireworks come in then?
Through the letterbox apparently lol