Old Brock facing the chop

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
That wrought iron fishin rod is gonna be a bugger to fly fish with.

I will try cain then lol

thanks for the heads up
So you know how to identify the appropriate ores and how to mine them and smelt them ??
No, but not impossible to learn, these fellows did it some time ago I believe

Sooooo to sum up .....Blue in favour of return to pre industrial society .... have you ever heard of the khmer rouge ????

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
have you ever heard of the khmer rouge ????

no but have herd of the Moulin Rouge :grin:

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
That wrought iron fishin rod is gonna be a bugger to fly fish with.

I will try cain then lol

thanks for the heads up
So you know how to identify the appropriate ores and how to mine them and smelt them ??
No, but not impossible to learn, these fellows did it some time ago I believe

Sooooo to sum up .....Blue in favour of return to pre industrial society .... have you ever heard of the khmer rouge ????
OK, I will sum up for you staggs, you asked why farmers seamed to get hand outs when other industry's seamed not to. As I said, I do not know the official reason for this, but for me the farming industry is far more important than all of those.
Yes I will concede that farming will use implements manufactured by the other industry's, but my feelings on this is that those workers in those industry's require the basics to survive and work, without the food produced by the farmer those steel workers can not do their jobs.
In times of need such as world wars the Farmer is the lynch pin, without the farmers in this country and other country's many in the UK would have starved. Yes big metal ships brought us food and weapons from other country's, but the people who built the ships, weapons, and navigated the ships full of food to our shores will have not been able to do do so without the food from their farmer industry.
This is my reasoning staggs, farmers are more important to our basic survival than any other industry
You asked if any one could tell you why farmers get funding when other industry's no longer do, I believe this could be some thing to do with it
No, I would not wish to return to pre-indutrial revolution Staggs, my point was farmers managed to produce food back then without the help of your coal or steel.

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
That wrought iron fishin rod is gonna be a bugger to fly fish with.

I will try cain then lol

thanks for the heads up
So you know how to identify the appropriate ores and how to mine them and smelt them ??
No, but not impossible to learn, these fellows did it some time ago I believe

Sooooo to sum up .....Blue in favour of return to pre industrial society .... have you ever heard of the khmer rouge ????
OK, I will sum up for you staggs, you asked why farmers seamed to get hand outs when other industry's seamed not to. As I said, I do not know the official reason for this, but for me the farming industry is far more important than all of those.
Yes I will concede that farming will use implements manufactured by the other industry's, but my feelings on this is that those workers in those industry's require the basics to survive and work, without the food produced by the farmer those steel workers can not do their jobs.
In times of need such as world wars the Farmer is the lynch pin, without the farmers in this country and other country's many in the UK would have starved. Yes big metal ships brought us food and weapons from other country's, but the people who built the ships, weapons, and navigated the ships full of food to our shores will have not been able to do do so without the food from their farmer industry.
This is my reasoning staggs, farmers are more important to our basic survival than any other industry
You asked if any one could tell you why farmers get funding when other industry's no longer do, I believe this could be some thing to do with it
No, I would not wish to return to pre-indutrial revolution Staggs, my point was farmers managed to produce food back then without the help of your coal or steel.
And all this to do with Old Brock facing the chop, how ?
Does pre-industrial farming bear any resemblance with farming today, here in the UK ?
No
Is UK farming today actually one industry, or just a group of 'activities' grouped together ?
Surely the latter
The initial thread was Badgers and bovine TB, so almost of no relevance to the growers within the UK farming.
Even within the livestock side of UK farming, there are sub-divisions depending on the livestock or poultry being reared, and even within the cattle sub-division not all farmers are affected by bovine TB, nor are all these cattle rearing farmers in favour of a cull, or the testing method currently used.

22 Dec 2011

Quote by HnS
And all this to do with Old Brock facing the chop, how ?
Nothing, threads ebb and flow, if you care to read back you can see hoe the discussion developed
Does pre-industrial farming bear any resemblance with farming today, here in the UK ?
No
Is UK farming today actually one industry, or just a group of 'activities' grouped together ?
Surely the latter
The initial thread was Badgers and bovine TB, so almost of no relevance to the growers within the UK farming.
Even within the livestock side of UK farming, there are sub-divisions depending on the livestock or poultry being reared, and even within the cattle sub-division not all farmers are affected by bovine TB, nor are all these cattle rearing farmers in favour of a cull, or the testing method currently used.

I have not made any connection between the cull and my discussion with Staggs re the pre-industrial revolution. Please feel free to read back if you so wish wink

22 Dec 2011

Go on then Blue I'll tell you the real reason..... rural areas are more inclined to vote tory ...tory M.P's are more likely to benefit from any subsidy paid to farmers ... no party will end farm subsidies the Tories want to keep the vote and Labour want to win it.... simples

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
Go on then Blue I'll tell you the real reason..... rural areas are more inclined to vote tory ...tory M.P's are more likely to benefit from any subsidy paid to farmers ... no party will end farm subsidies the Tories want to keep the vote and Labour want to win it.... simples

It may have some bearing, why would other industry's not have the same clout?

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
Go on then Blue I'll tell you the real reason..... rural areas are more inclined to vote tory ...tory M.P's are more likely to benefit from any subsidy paid to farmers ... no party will end farm subsidies the Tories want to keep the vote and Labour want to win it.... simples

I still think the subsidies have more to do with the EU and the CAP

22 Dec 2011

But its fair to say Max that public subsidy of the private business of farming goes back way longer than the 70s surely.

22 Dec 2011

I'm sure that's true Ben. Other industries were also subsidised back then too.
The CAP accounts for nearly half the EU Budget...and if UK farmers do so well out of it, you can bet that the French do even better.

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
Go on then Blue I'll tell you the real reason..... rural areas are more inclined to vote tory ...tory M.P's are more likely to benefit from any subsidy paid to farmers ... no party will end farm subsidies the Tories want to keep the vote and Labour want to win it.... simples

It may have some bearing, why would other industry's not have the same clout?
Most other industry is centralised around working class areas and are peopled by the working classes...The Tories have no real hope or ambition to win this vote and Labour abandoned it in favour of buttering up the middle classes in the late 80's

22 Dec 2011

do these classes still exist in modern 2011 britain?
i think
the class system was outdated about 25 yeers ago now :thumbup:

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Max777
Go on then Blue I'll tell you the real reason..... rural areas are more inclined to vote tory ...tory M.P's are more likely to benefit from any subsidy paid to farmers ... no party will end farm subsidies the Tories want to keep the vote and Labour want to win it.... simples

I still think the subsidies have more to do with the EU and the CAP
The ones from Europe certainly do Max .... but the topic here is a massive subsidy to rid farmers of a problem that, if it threatened engineering,for instance,would be dismissed as something that industry should take responsibility for ... some are left to sink,others it would appear are offered first class accommodation on the nearest luxury liner

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
Go on then Blue I'll tell you the real reason..... rural areas are more inclined to vote tory ...tory M.P's are more likely to benefit from any subsidy paid to farmers ... no party will end farm subsidies the Tories want to keep the vote and Labour want to win it.... simples

I still think the subsidies have more to do with the EU and the CAP
The ones from Europe certainly do Max .... but the topic here is a massive subsidy to rid farmers of a problem that, if it threatened engineering,for instance,would be dismissed as something that industry should take responsibility for ... some are left to sink,others it would appear are offered first class accommodation on the nearest luxury liner
Apologies Staggers, it appeared to me that you had widened the debate to subsidies (plural) paid to farmers, not a specific subsidy.

22 Dec 2011

To be fare, this is not a subsidy, this is the estimated cost of policing or protecting the farmer from animal rights extremist's. The money will go the police not the farmers!

22 Dec 2011

Quote by starlightcouple
do these classes still exist in modern 2011 britain?
i think
the class system was outdated about 25 yeers ago now :thumbup:

The class system has been outdate for a damn site longer than that .... it is still alive and well though

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
To be fare, this is not a subsidy, this is the estimated cost of policing or protecting the farmer from animal rights extremist's. The money will go the police not the farmers!

Who pays for the policing of football matches ???
It is a subsidy to allow the farmers to sort out a problem that exists in their industry

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
To be fare, this is not a subsidy, this is the estimated cost of policing or protecting the farmer from animal rights extremist's. The money will go the police not the farmers!

Who pays for the policing of football matches ???
It is a subsidy to allow the farmers to sort out a problem that exists in their industry
Why would animal rights protesters be the problem of farmers??

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
To be fare, this is not a subsidy, this is the estimated cost of policing or protecting the farmer from animal rights extremist's. The money will go the police not the farmers!

Who pays for the policing of football matches ???
It is a subsidy to allow the farmers to sort out a problem that exists in their industry
Who pays for the policing of demonstrations, who pays for the cost of policing drunken town centres on a Friday and Saturday night. Is this not subsiding of the drinks industry then and in the main, in working class areas?

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
To be fare, this is not a subsidy, this is the estimated cost of policing or protecting the farmer from animal rights extremist's. The money will go the police not the farmers!

Who pays for the policing of football matches ???
It is a subsidy to allow the farmers to sort out a problem that exists in their industry
Why would animal rights protesters be the problem of farmers??
very cute ...nice sidestep there,do you play rugby ??
And why would (using your logic) hooligans be the problem of football clubs ??
As you well know I meant Badgers (the problem) ...are farmers having to pay the full cost of the cull btw or are funds available.

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
To be fare, this is not a subsidy, this is the estimated cost of policing or protecting the farmer from animal rights extremist's. The money will go the police not the farmers!

Who pays for the policing of football matches ???
It is a subsidy to allow the farmers to sort out a problem that exists in their industry
Why would animal rights protesters be the problem of farmers??
very cute ...nice sidestep there,do you play rugby ??
And why would (using your logic) hooligans be the problem of football clubs ??
As you well know I meant Badgers (the problem) ...are farmers having to pay the full cost of the cull btw or are funds available.
They are football fans going to a football match, these are not farming fans coming to support their local farmer, quite the opposite.
I would hazard a guess many farmers will do the job themselves, hence the required protection

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Bluefish2009
They are football fans going to a football match, these are not farming fans coming to support their local farmer, quite the opposite.
I would hazard a guess many farmers will do the job themselves, hence the required protection

Or you could say they are members of the public gathering to cause trouble .... fits both groups under these circumstances,you can wriggle as much as you like Blue but we both know the truth

22 Dec 2011

Quote by Staggerlee_BB

They are football fans going to a football match, these are not farming fans coming to support their local farmer, quite the opposite.
I would hazard a guess many farmers will do the job themselves, hence the required protection

Or you could say they are members of the public gathering to cause trouble .... fits both groups under these circumstances,you can wriggle as much as you like Blue but we both know the truth
I don't feel like I am wriggling Staggs, feels more like you may be clutching at straws now
Trouble makers are not the responsibility of farmers :thumbup:
For me the facts here are very simple. Unlike a football match the farmers are not selling tickets, neither are they inviting anyone along. So the crowd is not their crowd.
The crowd is an animal rights protest, the only reason for police is for the protection of farmers and perhaps members of the general public from any extremist elements of the animal rights movement. As far as I am aware we do not charge anyone for the protection afforded by the police against violence.
If one was attacked or robbed would you expect that person to pay for the police to attend?
This is a strange thing to request or expect, would you see all who demonstrate pay for the policing?
Would you implement this retrospectively? If so can we then claim back the cost of the policing operation during the minor’s strikes of the 80s?

22 Dec 2011

I believe football clubs pay for match day policing.
Shouldn't the badger hunters do the same.
Oh and since the snow last year we aint seen a badger round here cos in the snow they are too easy to track and the locals love any excuse to kill any animal they dont own or can sell for a profit.

23 Dec 2011

Quote by Ben_Minx
I believe football clubs pay for match day policing.
Shouldn't the badger hunters do the same.
Oh and since the snow last year we aint seen a badger round here cos in the snow they are too easy to track and the locals love any excuse to kill any animal they dont own or can sell for a profit.

The farmers are not selling any tickets so will have no crowd to control.
However animal rights campaigners will be sending out invitation's I believe so maybe if your looking for where to send the bill.....
One does not need snow to track a badger, if locals are killing badgers in your area I suggest you inform the authority's as that is illegal. As a sub-note Ben, anyone who was of that mind would not go to the lengths of tracking at night when they spend all day in their set!! dunno

23 Dec 2011

I dunno blue I just know that round here badger hunting (illegal) happens at night.

22 Jan 2012

LANDOWNERS and farmers in West Gloucestershire and West Somerset will be able to apply for licences to pilot controlled shooting of badgers, Agriculture Minister Jim Paice has confirmed.

5 Mar 2012

6 Mar 2012

Anyone watch Panorama last night ??....seems some farmers doing very nicely !!!

paid for doing nothing..I'll have some of that

6 Mar 2012

Quote by Ben_Minx
I dunno blue I just know that round here badger hunting (illegal) happens at night.

:laughabove::laughabove::laughabove:
i don't want this to come as a shock but badgers are nocturnal so would it not make sense to hunt them at night dunno

Are you sure?