The teeth that saved the world

30 Jul 2010

Churchill dentures sell for £15,000, three times their estimate
A fitting price and name for these historical wonders from a man of such stature and ability.....Unless you know otherwise wink

30 Jul 2010

My dad served thru WWII. Hated churchill said he was a total arse and teh war wouldnt have lasted as long without his utter incompetence.
I have no opinion on the matter although having read a book or two I've never understood quite why he is such a hero to folk nowadays.

30 Jul 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
My dad served thru WWII. Hated churchill said he was a total arse and teh war wouldnt have lasted as long without his utter incompetence.
I have no opinion on the matter although having read a book or two I've never understood quite why he is such a hero to folk nowadays.

Interesting Ben, my Grandfather served in the Royal Navy from 1912 until the end of the second world war, my Father served in two Scottish regiments during the Second World War,getting seriously injured in Italy....
Both had a very high regard for the man dunno

30 Jul 2010

My dad was in italy aint it funny they could have served shoulder to shoulder. Yeah opinions varied I am sure I just wonder why he is deified.

30 Jul 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
My dad was in italy aint it funny they could have served shoulder to shoulder. Yeah opinions varied I am sure I just wonder why he is deified.

Its a small world Ben.
I think that has to do with his several things, two of which are his powerful speeches, and he was Prime-minister at the time the war was won. The modern media put the two together so often and him on a pedestal

30 Jul 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
My dad served thru WWII. Hated churchill said he was a total arse and teh war wouldnt have lasted as long without his utter incompetence.

No of course it would not have....we would have lost the war by 1943.

Quote by Ben_welshminx
I have no opinion on the matter although having read a book or two I've never understood quite why he is such a hero to folk nowadays.

I wonder also why he is the only PM ever to have been given a state funeral....such a strange thing to do for a man with so much incompetence.
Funny old world.

30 Jul 2010

Churchill was deemed fit for a state funeral because the press had never exposed the truth about his less than cuddly nature.....therefore the public where kept in the dark and believed the bullshit about his single-handed victory in WW2 (the sequel).Given a full and free reporting of the facts I doubt he would have received one.
I have no real interest in military history inc. WW2 (the sequel)...I do have an interest in the political and social history of this country.....I would suggest that those who express an interest in WW2 (the sequel)read about it and the main players therein
P.S. my dad is too young to have served during the war and has never ever expressed to me an opinion about Churchill

30 Jul 2010

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
Churchill was deemed fit for a state funeral because the press had never exposed the truth about his less than cuddly nature.....therefore the public where kept in the dark and believed the bullshit about his single-handed victory in WW2 (the sequel).Given a full and free reporting of the facts I doubt he would have received one.
I have real interest in military history inc. WW2 (the sequel)...I do have an interest in the political and social history of this country.....I would suggest that those who express an interest in WW2 (the sequel)read about it and the main players therein
P.S. my dad is too young to have served during the war and has never ever expressed to me an opinion about Churchill

I feel short changed some how wink

30 Jul 2010

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
Churchill was deemed fit for a state funeral because the press had never exposed the truth about his less than cuddly nature.....therefore the public where kept in the dark and believed the bullshit about his single-handed victory in WW2 (the sequel).Given a full and free reporting of the facts I doubt he would have received one.
I have real interest in military history inc. WW2 (the sequel)...I do have an interest in the political and social history of this country.....I would suggest that those who express an interest in WW2 (the sequel)read about it and the main players therein
P.S. my dad is too young to have served during the war and has never ever expressed to me an opinion about Churchill

my grandfather who was a miner always shuddered at any mention of his name and would always recant churhills words when he was home secretary during the 1926 general strike.
"starve the women and children and the men will go back to work" churchill obviously knew of marie antoinettes reference to "cake" staggers.

30 Jul 2010

my apologies I did mean to say "I have no real interest in military history..." I have changed this now

30 Jul 2010

Ah gulson that explains a lot I believe my father may have been one such child.

30 Jul 2010

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
Churchill was deemed fit for a state funeral because the press had never exposed the truth about his less than cuddly nature.....therefore the public where kept in the dark and believed the bullshit about his single-handed victory in WW2 (the sequel).Given a full and free reporting of the facts I doubt he would have received one.

Lets say that if your one eyed slant on things was correct, can you explain to me why now after how many years he is still deemed to be the best PM this country has ever seen, in every poll that has been undertaken?
In a huge ammount of polls by the public, he comes out top almost every time in the greatest English person?
Even after all these years and all the so called rubbish you say about him, are you saying now that things are still being hidden about him from the beloved press?
You do talk some rubbish at times Staggs.
Or was it simply that he was a leader of the party you hate the most?....I wonder if that is why you take the view you do.
But answer the questions above...RATIONALLY.

There are loads more....still such a shit leader...yes? loon

30 Jul 2010

Ya cant argue wi woodlands primary school they know their political history.

30 Jul 2010

Would you like to put a valid reason to the BBC one then?
I can supply links all day long to this, but you would lose....ya usually do. lol

Also what is refreshing to be honest is that whilst they are young children, even they can recognise a great English person. Now who said kids were dumb, even ones as young as this?
Puts some adults to shame these little kiddies can. Good on the teacher and the National Curriculum for teaching kids the importance of Churchill.

30 Jul 2010

I think I am relatively content because I know that:
I don't have to agree with the majority.
The majority view is not always correct.
Knowing this means I don't have to get over excited about trivia and can debate in a rational manner.
Stamping ones foot and proclaiming Churchill is a hero because a lot of people say so is pointless ( the BBC poll). I accept that he is widely regarded as a God, I just wondered why when, as other posters have pointed out, the man was evidently a bit of a twat.
In the words of the late great Jake Thackray.
The bull the bull is the biggest of all,
He is the boss he is because he's big and we are small.
But the bigger the bull. the bigger the bull;
The bigger and quicker and slicker and thicker,
The bull shite falls.

30 Jul 2010

Sorry cannot help but think had he been a leader of the Labour party your thoughts may well be different?
Still not going to bother myself with this one anymore, the ammount of people who voted and will continue to vote for him, is good enough for me.
Just think though that without him maybe just maybe, things would have been completely different, and just possibly under another party other than the free speaking ones we have at the moment, and since 1945. Just a thought.

31 Jul 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
I think I am relatively content because I know that:
I don't have to agree with the majority.
The majority view is not always correct.
Knowing this means I don't have to get over excited about trivia and can debate in a rational manner.
Stamping ones foot and proclaiming Churchill is a hero because a lot of people say so is pointless ( the BBC poll). I accept that he is widely regarded as a God, I just wondered why when, as other posters have pointed out, the man was evidently a bit of a twat.
In the words of the late great Jake Thackray.
The bull the bull is the biggest of all,
He is the boss he is because he's big and we are small.
But the bigger the bull. the bigger the bull;
The bigger and quicker and slicker and thicker,
The bull shite falls.

I do not personally see him as a God, in fact, at this stage in my life, I find myself not worshiping any God!
I make my decision on liking the man based on what I have read and possibly some influence from my Father and Uncle. I know full well he done thing and suggested things we all find unpleasant but in my view that was the type of man that time called for

31 Jul 2010

Quote by kentswingers777
stuff

Lets say that if your one eyed slant on things was correct, can you explain to me why now after how many years he is still deemed to be the best PM this country has ever seen, in every poll that has been undertaken?
In a huge ammount of polls by the public, he comes out top almost every time in the greatest English person?
Mr Blobby was no.1 in the charts, does this make it the best record at the time ?popularity is a poor measure of quality
Even after all these years and all the so called rubbish you say about him, are you saying now that things are still being hidden about him from the beloved press?No I'm saying that because so little of the truth was ever published at the time (for good reason I hasten to add)that a myth was allowed to grow around him....and unfortunately myth is more enduring than truth
You do talk some rubbish at times Staggs.
Ditto
Or was it simply that he was a leader of the party you hate the most?....I wonder if that is why you take the view you do.
He was at times both a conservative and a liberal...he was an opportunist of the worst kind....the recent politician I could compare him to would be the liar Archer
But answer the questions above...RATIONALLY.
I have done, I'm not blind to the qualities of the man,and I do not hate him...look up the word ICONOCLAST, the truth in anything is more illuminating than the would be surprised to find that I actually have a deal of admiration for the man,what I refuse to do is lie about his or anyone else's nature.....Churchills 'greatness' was in that he achieved much DESPITE his flaws....ignoring them does him a disservice....the sad fact is that he a poor peace time leader and a second class military mind...he was however (like Hitler ) a great orator and a great mover of minds,and this is where his true service to this country lay

There are loads more....still such a shit leader...yes? loon

31 Jul 2010

Ya still cannot do the quote thingy then?
Now which one told me how to do it?...........hmmm I think they all did, and between them I suddenly got it.
Makes for easier reading and is easier to reply that way.
Now where are me notes.

31 Jul 2010

Quote by kentswingers777
Ya still cannot do the quote thingy then?
Now which one told me how to do it?...........hmmm I think they all did, and between them I suddenly got it.
Makes for easier reading and is easier to reply that way.
Now where are me notes.

No can't do the quote thingy .....that all you've got??.Sorry did I take you by surprise with my lucid reasonable argument??I'll just wait for yours then shall I ??

31 Jul 2010

Thanks for the interesting post stags. I can see I need a decent churchill biography. Can anybody recommend one that they have read and did not fine intolerably dull?

31 Jul 2010

This one actually is very interesting.

It helps if people read all of it though and not just the first two lines.
Jolly entertaining I thought.

31 Jul 2010

Quote by Ben_welshminx
Ya cant argue wi woodlands primary school they know their political history.

They're a quality source, you have to admit. So is a dial in poll for the BBC...
FFS,Churchill couldn't even win the general election at the end of World War 2! He didn't win the next one, and only got in in 1951 with a smaller share of the popular vote than Attlee got.

1 Aug 2010

funny ol thread this one
i read other threads humans are fallible blah, blah, blah boo hoo bitch bitch
than all of a sudden churchill`s a wanker dunno

i know three things important things about Churchill
1: he gave some of the most important speeches in the history of the British isles (although they was probably wrote for him by someone else )
2: he rallied troops and people like no other prime minister at war before or since
3: when called upon he did the job and did it well regardless of previous or future failings
and them three things are all i wanna know about him
he did leave a legacy as 30% of all bulldogs are called Winni or Winston
now if were really talking wankers and war i nominate Blair

1 Aug 2010

Quote by Lizaleanrob
funny ol thread this one
i read other threads humans are fallible blah, blah, blah boo hoo bitch bitch
than all of a sudden churchill`s a wanker
i know three things important things about Churchill
1: he gave some of the most important speeches in the history of the British isles (although they was probably wrote for him by someone else )
2: he rallied troops and people like no other prime minister at war before or since
3: when called upon he did the job and did it well regardless of previous or future failings
and them three things are all i wanna know about him
he did leave a legacy as 30% of all bulldogs are called Winni or Winston
now if were really talking wankers and war i nominate Blair

Very valid points Rob :thumbup:

1 Aug 2010

i watched a good doc on sky about ww2 blue and decisions where very different then. information and intelligence was days and weeks old a lot was misinterpreted due to Morse code
add the fact that we had troops in many different countries given all these factors its a
small miracle and a blessing we won
and in them circumstance`s he deserve`s praise and respect indeed wink

1 Aug 2010

Quote by Lizaleanrob
small miracle and a blessing we won

IMO the small miracle is that the Russians and Americans were brought into the war. Without their material and manpower then the outcome would have been somewhat different. I believe that a negotiated truce would have had to have come about by 1941-42, if they had not been brought in to the war.
It was the Axis failings rather than Churchill that let Britain be part of the winning side.
Dave_Notts

1 Aug 2010

Quote by Dave__Notts

small miracle and a blessing we won

IMO the small miracle is that the Russians and Americans were brought into the war. Without their material and manpower then the outcome would have been somewhat different. I believe that a negotiated truce would have had to have come about by 1941-42, if they had not been brought in to the war.
It was the Axis failings rather than Churchill that let Britain be part of the winning side.
Dave_Notts
I don't think anyone intimated he did it single handed, we know he did not, but that does not negate the important role he played

1 Aug 2010

Quote by Bluefish2009

small miracle and a blessing we won

IMO the small miracle is that the Russians and Americans were brought into the war. Without their material and manpower then the outcome would have been somewhat different. I believe that a negotiated truce would have had to have come about by 1941-42, if they had not been brought in to the war.
It was the Axis failings rather than Churchill that let Britain be part of the winning side.
Dave_Notts
I don't think anyone intimated he did it single handed, we know he did not, but that does not negate the important role he played
He was important, so were a number of people within the UK and the Empire. Without them the war would have been lost sooner. He done some great things and some shitty things, that is why he cannot be godlike because of his massive failings. Gallipoli was a monumental cockup in the first degree......and it was Churchill who was in charge.
What he was IMO was a good orator and his speeches have been held in high regard. His "Few" and "Fight on the beaches" speeches was what was needed at the time and are still awe inspiring when listening to them today.
Dave_Notts

1 Aug 2010

Quote by Dave__Notts

small miracle and a blessing we won

IMO the small miracle is that the Russians and Americans were brought into the war. Without their material and manpower then the outcome would have been somewhat different. I believe that a negotiated truce would have had to have come about by 1941-42, if they had not been brought in to the war.
It was the Axis failings rather than Churchill that let Britain be part of the winning side.
Dave_Notts
I don't think anyone intimated he did it single handed, we know he did not, but that does not negate the important role he played
He was important, so were a number of people within the UK and the Empire. Without them the war would have been lost sooner. He done some great things and some shitty things, that is why he cannot be godlike because of his massive failings. Gallipoli was a monumental cockup in the first degree......and it was Churchill who was in charge.
What he was IMO was a good orator and his speeches have been held in high regard. His "Few" and "Fight on the beaches" speeches was what was needed at the time and are still awe inspiring when listening to them today.
Dave_Notts
I don't think anyone would argue with any of that
I might take a little issue again with Gallipoli, as I mentioned in another thread, As for Gallipoli, I believe if the navy had continued to force the Dardanelles as Churchill wished things could have been very different. I have read quite a bit on this and some historians firmly believe the Turks would have scummed had the Navy not given up when it did, due to the Turks poor moral and dwindling supplies of heavy munitions. Also if they had acted as he had suggested in September 1914 this may have also helped.
Things at Gallipoli may have been very different indeed
During the second World War his influance on moral of troops and the country were in my view paramount