Is some swinging a type of polyamoury?

2 Sep 2004

Myself and Mrs Phil_osopher are interested in 'polyamoury' (see for a detailed FAQ) - if you don't know what it is, basically, it's about being able to love more than one person and have relationships with them. It's not something that people in the UK tend to know about, for some reason.
After seeing people talking about getting into swinging for social reasons on some of the recent threads in here, I'm just wondering how close to polyamoury swinging is.
Obviously, some swingers are interested in just sex, as it's their favourite hobby or obsession or addiction ( Mrs Phil_osopher! ...are you looking at me? lol

), but I'm really thinking of the swingers who are quite keen on the social aspect of swinging as I've heard of cases where people have got into polyamoury through swinging - and vice versa.
I'd be very interested to know:
a) Have you ever heard of polyamoury, or know what it is/ tried it, etc?
b) What do you think the relationship is between swinging and polyamoury?
To answer these questions for myself and Mrs Phil_osopher:
a) We have tried polyamoury for about 2 years with 2 different bi-females, but these relationships came to an end (I think) because social pressure on the these people made them think they had to 'hide' their relationship with us, and this was 'doing their heads in'.
b) I think that swinging and polyamoury are quite closely related - polyamoury is just taking things a little step further and bringing things into the 'strings attached' area, rather than just going for the excitement of one-offs. This is probably an attractive option for some swingers (although I may well be totally wrong on this!)
What do you think?
(now I'm gonna sit and wait for this thread to fall off the bottom of the page, I reckon... ) :cry:

2 Sep 2004

Hmmm... I can never resist deep discussion such as these...
People truly capable of Polyamoury must be the most generous, secure, confident and sweet natured of people to be able to give of themselves to such relationships... I wonder why some societies have forbidden it... in legal terms I mean.
I cannot imagine of a more wonderful world to be in if you can whole heartedly commit to such an arrangement. In the two years that you experienced it was there jealousy and if so how did you over come the problem of the green eyed monster? As long as you all shared everything and were honestly in love with each other... then I can genuinely see how it would work...
I tell you what a great society we humans could emulate and that is Bonobo chimpanzees. They solve everything by shagging each other senseless... lol

Here is the URL to read more about Bonobo Chimpanzees...

2 Sep 2004

Quote by phil_osopher
(now I'm gonna sit and wait for this thread to fall off the bottom of the page, I reckon... ) :cry:

Phil~
Oh, sure, shame us into responding... rolleyes

...eh, was going to anyway.
a) I'm familiar with polyamoury, but have never tried it. Personally, I don't think I could truly be "in love" with two (or more) people at once unless they shared the same bond between themselves. And if it's difficult just to find one true love for yourself, just think how much more exponentially difficult that would become to find a third person who could genuinely fulfill the same criteria for both individuals of the original twosome. I'm sure I'm making it overly complicated by introducing the "mutuality" requirement, but I cannot even entertain the thought apart from this.
b) I, too, would say that swinging and polyamoury are closely related, the difference being with the degree of commitment. That said, I'm not very good with the "NSA" aspect of swinging. At the very least, I need some sort of bond or connection to exist - be it intellectual, emotional, spiritual, whatever - before I can be truly comfortable becoming physically intimate with another person...and one thing I could never get my head around was "one-night stands". Does this make be a bad swinger? Perhaps, but only if the idea of potentially forming long-term relationships is contrary to the lifestyle. Further, if you have steady, stable and secure swinging partner(s), you can not only be reasonably assured of respect, compatibility and safety; you also have the opportunity to learn more about them and their desires over time, thereby getting the most out of the relationship. The thought of sharing Vix' & my extraordinary bond as soul-mates with another individual is one that I take deadly seriously, which, in turn, seriously colours my perspective on the "lifestyle extension" that swinging has to offer. So, in our case, is it really swinging? Polyamoury? Or something in between?
Dunno if this answers your question, but wanted to get my thoughts in before your thread quietly drifted off the bottom of the page. :P
~Reese! surprised

2 Sep 2004

Bless you guys! Thanks for responding!!! (well, I'd bless you if I believed in that sort of thing anyway... smile

)
Wibbly,

Quote by WibblyWobbly
In the two years that you experienced it was there jealousy and if so how did you over come the problem of the green eyed monster? As long as you all shared everything and were honestly in love with each other... then I can genuinely see how it would work...

Well, that's about the right idea - there has to be 'chemistry' between everyone otherwise it's just not going to work. Jealousy shouldn't be an issue, because, as you say, you've got be be loving and trusting of each other - also, since the shagging element is usually in the form of a 3some, you actually knowwhat everyone else is getting up to first-hand! So why get jealous? I suppose we're programmed as a society to get jealous - people get their information on how to deal with society from the TV these days, and the average episode of EastEnders has all sorts of jealous rages over the most minor things... *sigh*
Actually, I imagine it helps if it's not in your nature to be jealous, which is pretty much how it is with us.
Reese,

Quote by Reese
Oh, sure, shame us into responding...

Sorry to shame you into replying - I apologise - I really expected few, if any, replies - I have to admit that my expectations were slim, since it seems that the average thread around here revolves around someone's trip to the supermarket this morning... OK, there's a place for that too, it's a free world (and a fantastically free web-site! Thanks again Mark!)
I sort of agree with your 'a' statement - it is difficult to find 'true' love - but how about other kinds of love - you love your relations (well, some people do!) You love your pet animals, your children etc etc - I think there can also be another kind of love for people you live with, or are close to, and have a sexual relationship with. As a society, we don't tend to find out about this love because we haven't attempted it. Myself and Mrs Phil_osopher have tried it, and we like it!
As a sort of analogy to illustrate what I'm saying - you don't know what a kangaroo steak tastes like 'til you try it, and we wouldn't even know about the existence of kangaroos if someone hadn't bumped into Australia on their travels...
As for your 'b' statement - I can relate to what you're saying - we also have a very special relationship, which I don't think I could take into the NSA arena - I need more than just sex (although I *do* love it!) as far as I'm concerned (and I'm probably in the minority on this site wink

- if I'm going to have NSA sex, I might as well get to know my right hand better, as it's easier to arrange smile

)
Ta for the great responses!

2 Sep 2004

Quote by phil_osopher
I sort of agree with your 'a' statement - it is difficult to find 'true' love - but how about other kinds of love - you love your relations (well, some people do!) You love your pet animals, your children etc etc - I think there can also be another kind of love for people you live with, or are close to, and have a sexual relationship with. As a society, we don't tend to find out about this love because we haven't attempted it. Myself and Mrs Phil_osopher have tried it, and we like it!

Phil~
Seems we're definitely on the same wavelength. Here's a quote from a PM that I'd sent to another SH member just a few days before your post...

Quote by Reese
Can you genuinely "fall in love" with another couple? I don't know. I've had many loves in my life - family, pets, friends, etc with which I've shared other sorts of intimacies - but none of these can hold a candle to the bond that is shared with a true partner and soul-mate. Why should it be so different with another couple, as more of a "familial love" or "friendship love" than a "true love"? I have had many loves in my life, but I have only one true love, one all-consuming soul-mate around which my life revolves.

...granted, not true polyamoury as I understand the definition, but moreso a personal take on the manifold expressions of love.
Just wanted to share that as an extension to my original reply.
~Reese! surprised

2 Sep 2004

Well ive never heard of polyamoury,and to be honest its not something that i'd ever dream of.
I see swinging as having sexual relations with others for the thrill of it,its purely sexual,and if friends are made out of it too then love is a completely different kettle of fish!My love for Steve is all consuming,i can't possibly imagine feeling that way for anyone else,or wanting to!
Yes i have different love for my kids and my family and friends,but that is completely different love for different kinds of relationships.
Also having an intensely,deeply,emotionally consuming relationship is hard work enough,the thoughts of trying to do that with another person too is beyond me,my one true love is enough for me and thats entirely the way i want it to stay!!

2 Sep 2004

Have had this discussion with lots and lots of people . Its just semantics really and polyamory is one of those great dead language rooted words that people use to lend respectability to something which isnt seen as such . I reckon as a discussion it really boils down teh age old question of wether swinging is right or wrong . Talking round in circles about definitions of morality and societys structure and religion is the traditional route at this point in the conversation , but we wont do that as I just cant be arsed yet again , but in my humble opinion all the conversations Ive ever had regarding it have ended up with the same basic quandry who are the most insecure people those that think swinging is correct or those that think it is wrong ??
G

3 Sep 2004

Polyamoury....
Isnt that the place in scotland with the annoying people and the blody awfull singing... you know....
"whats the story with polyamoury...."

3 Sep 2004

Reese,
Yep! Looks like we're on the same page!
I guess love and friendship are all part of one big continuum. You love some things more, you love some things less, and there are just different names for it, along the way...
Clare,
Yes - I think I know where you are coming from - as I said - I think someswinging is a bit like polyamoury. Other types of swinging are for the sheer joy of sex, pure and simple, No-Strings fun! I imagine that's your angle on it! I think it's a great way to enjoy yourself, and I wouldn't mind that either - but, for me, I need a bit more than that sometimes... smile

Big G,
I sort of see you point of view - I'm asking the question about the line between swinging and polyamoury really - I would say that swinging really becomes polyamoury when the people you swing with start becoming a part of your life outside of just having sex. I don't really care about morality and ethics and all of that stuff, because everyone's code of morality is a little bit different, so there's no point in talking about it because it does tend to go around in circles. What I'm really trying to get out of people is their view on whether they just swing or whether they are actually friends, lovers or partners with the people they swing with.
Jon,
Isn't that Auchtermuchty??? smile

3 Sep 2004

Does there have to be a link between swinging and poly?
If all members of poly relationship only shag each other they are not swingers, just cos there is more than two in the relationship. If however they choose to include more people occassionally in their relationship they are swingers, just like a couple would be.
Yeah, some swinging couples have regular shag pieces that they see a lot but very few would be classed as poly relatiopnships, methinks.
I've known a couple of people in poly relationships. They weren't swingers and didn't want to be, they just had two partners....
Over and out confused

3 Sep 2004

Quote by bluexxx
Does there have to be a link between swinging and poly?

Nope! - I'm just thinking out loud - was wondering what other people thought. There are some links - on the other hand, as I said, swinging also has it's NSA sex side. It's great for both sides, and I'm happy for everyone, whatever they want.
There are some 'open poly relationships', which can seem more like swinging (particularly to people in closed poly relationships! smile

) - it's really a questoin of what you call poly, and what you call swinging - I don't think it's a clear-cut line - other people might think it is...
cool

7 Sep 2004

Hi phil_osopher
I noticed this thread a few days ago but didn't have time to post so I thought I would resurrect it for a while.
I have to admit to finding the whole topic of human relationships fascinating and Charlotte and I have spent a lot of time since we started exploring the swinging scene talking about how we feel, what we want etc etc.
To answer your questions.
a) Polyamory was not something I had heard of previous to this thread but Charlotte and I have discussed the ideas of shared or communal living before. As far as experiencing it goes, we have developed something of a regular loving threesome with someone we met about six months ago. Unfortunately there are problems with his circumstances that stop us finding out whether this could become a more commited long term arrangement.
b) The relationship between Swinging and Polyamory seems very blurred, A lot of swinging is based on NSA sex with other people and emotional attachment is not ususlly involved, in fact often actively discouraged as in the case of 'no kissing' rules etc. However especially on this site there is a very strong community spirit that goes way beyond meeting for casual sex - at least among some of the members. This has I believe led to many great friendships being formed with people meeting or chatting regularly and sharing the non-sexual parts of their lives. This seems to me quite close to the professed ideals of polyamourous community.
Those are my thoughts and I find the whole topic very interesting. However does anyone have any links to current polyamorous sites or groups in the UK, I have tried various searches and they are either at least a couple of years out of date or based abroad. The best I can find is an article in Pentacle Magazine but this doesn't have any links to other sites.
Roger, rambling on again as usual. lol

7 Sep 2004

Quote by piercedJon
Polyamoury....
Isnt that the place in scotland with the annoying people and the blody awfull singing... you know....
"whats the story with polyamoury...."

hehe its Balamory but Polyamoury sounds better!!
I always thought it was polygamy?? Or is that a different thing again. I think people should have the right to do anything they want as long is its not harming anyone else.
I dont think Id be into it myself but then my reasons are I find it hard enough at times having relationships with singular people nevermind full time relationships with more than one person. Mebbie Im just selfish but I like my own space too much or maybe thats just my attitude because of previous relationships.
But who knows really? If you did happen to meet two people you felt you could share your life with equally and you had a strong bond and all are happy! Why not!

7 Sep 2004

Quote by rogerthedragon
The relationship between Swinging and Polyamory seems very blurred, A lot of swinging is based on NSA sex with other people and emotional attachment is not ususlly involved, in fact often actively discouraged as in the case of 'no kissing' rules etc. However especially on this site there is a very strong community spirit that goes way beyond meeting for casual sex - at least among some of the members. This has I believe led to many great friendships being formed with people meeting or chatting regularly and sharing the non-sexual parts of their lives. This seems to me quite close to the professed ideals of polyamourous community.

Roger~
Bloody hell!! You mean Vix & I have been doing this wrong all along?! :shock: I'm referring to the "no kissing" rule, which seems to be somewhat common based upon other discussions I've had. What's wrong with a good snog between friends? Personally, I feel that orally-entertaining another's genitalia is a bit higher on the intimacy scale!
Seriously, though, I find that other intimacies (intellectual, emotional, etc) only serve to enhance my enjoyment of another "3rd-party" individual or couple. And, the more familiar you become with each other, the more potential you have for mutual satisfaction! Are sharing multiple intimacies like this an expression of polyamoury?
This begs the question of the viability and acceptability of "long-term" swinging relationships: Would you and your partner entertain the idea of effectively "going steady" with another single or couple? Or would you only be comfortable with a short-term or one-off experience, thus minimizing the potential for "attachment"?
~Reese! surprised

7 Sep 2004

Quote by fruity1976
Polyamoury....

I always thought it was polygamy?? Or is that a different thing again.
Polyamoury means living in a multiple relationship...it can be polyandrous...multiple husbands or polygynous...multiple wives.

7 Sep 2004

Ahhhhhhhh, cheers! redface

7 Sep 2004

Roger,
As regards (a) - You're lucky buggers! biggrin

But seriously - I can see your interest in the area, and I know there are not a lot of resources around in the UK for this kind of thing. Sadly, it's not something that people around the UK seem to know very much about in a 'social' sense. There does seem to be a lot of connection between paganism (and sometimes goth culture) with 'poly', so perhaps you could start there.
There's probably a mail-group you could subscribe to, but the last one I subscribed to just dried up.
I believe you might find something a bit more useful at - which seems to have a mailing-list. There's a lot more info at
I know there used to be a London 'poly' group, but never went to it - there are probably similar ones around the big cities of the UK.
The biggest US site seems to be - I don't think there are too many UK people on it, but I don't really know it that well.
Reese,
A good argument - when does regular swinging with the same partner become a form of love? A very good question... Maybe the answer is 'When you start asking them to move in' - I dunno!
Good luck!

7 Sep 2004

Quote by Reese
Roger~
Bloody hell!! You mean Vix & I have been doing this wrong all along?! :shock: I'm referring to the "no kissing" rule, which seems to be somewhat common based upon other discussions I've had. What's wrong with a good snog between friends? Personally, I feel that orally-entertaining another's genitalia is a bit higher on the intimacy scale!

I have to say the rule about no-kissing is one we don't subscribe to, the usual reasons given are that it is too 'intimate' and that couples like to keep something 'just for themselves'. I apologise in advance to anyone who disagrees but in my opinion this shows that you are insecure about your relationship and need this extra evidence ie. "See she only loves me because she only kisses me"

Quote by Reese
Seriously, though, I find that other intimacies (intellectual, emotional, etc) only serve to enhance my enjoyment of another "3rd-party" individual or couple. And, the more familiar you become with each other, the more potential you have for mutual satisfaction! Are sharing multiple intimacies like this an expression of polyamoury?

I would agree whole-heartedly with this, the better we have got to know people the more fun we have had and the more you get to know other peoples preferences. This is why we like to chat to people beforehand and get to know them. One of the things that we have found a shame is when some of the people we have had good fun with have not wanted to chat or meet again.

Quote by Reese
This begs the question of the viability and acceptability of "long-term" swinging relationships: Would you and your partner entertain the idea of effectively "going steady" with another single or couple? Or would you only be comfortable with a short-term or one-off experience, thus minimizing the potential for "attachment"?
~Reese!

Personally we would consider 'long-term' relationships a good thing, getting to know other people and making good friends. However I realise a lot of people have no desire to share more than some no strings sex with people they meet. We on the other hand would view any meeting as possibly the first of many, that does not mean we would not enjoy a one-off meet or that we would persue people who decided they did not like the idea of meeting again, just that if we get on with people then seeing them again is always fine with us.
Roger (Rambling again. lol

)

7 Sep 2004

Bugger!!
Too deep for me. confused

7 Sep 2004

Quote by phil_osopher
Roger,
As regards (a) - You're lucky buggers!
But seriously - I can see your interest in the area, and I know there are not a lot of resources around in the UK for this kind of thing. Sadly, it's not something that people around the UK seem to know very much about in a 'social' sense. There does seem to be a lot of connection between paganism (and sometimes goth culture) with 'poly', so perhaps you could start there.
There's probably a mail-group you could subscribe to, but the last one I subscribed to just dried up.
I believe you might find something a bit more useful at - which seems to have a mailing-list. There's a lot more info at
I know there used to be a London 'poly' group, but never went to it - there are probably similar ones around the big cities of the UK.
The biggest US site seems to be - I don't think there are too many UK people on it, but I don't really know it that well.
Reese,
A good argument - when does regular swinging with the same partner become a form of love? A very good question... Maybe the answer is 'When you start asking them to move in' - I dunno!
Good luck!

Thanks for the links Phil_osopher.
I have found one good article in a pagan magazine but nothing more personal as yet.
I can't seem to get anything from the bi-org mailing list so I would guess it is no longer current.
The one though I hadn't found and it does have some good looking articles etc. - I will have to peruse it more later.
It seems that at the moment the best discussion on it in the UK is on here. lol

Swinging heaven rules again. lol

Roger.

7 Sep 2004

Didn't Amanda Barrie live with another woman and a husband for many years? With deepest apologies if I've got this wrong. Would that have been Poly-thingy?

7 Sep 2004

Wasn't she in th Corrie?
And previously a beauty in the Carry on Films amonsgt others - or have I got the wrong person too?

7 Sep 2004

Aye, that's t'one

7 Sep 2004

Well, if they were in some kind of 'love', I'd guess it would be 'poly'...
Apparently, Amanda Barrie has/had a thing for both sexes, but whether she had actually lived with other people in a 'love' relationship or not, I can't ascertain...
One review of her book "Life is not a rehearsal" states: "including the remarkable threesome that she shared with her husband Robin Hunter. "
So, maybe... perhaps...
Amanda, love... If you're on here, let us know, will you? Cheers!

7 Sep 2004

Quote by fruity1976
Polyamoury....
Isnt that the place in scotland with the annoying people and the blody awfull singing... you know....
"whats the story with polyamoury...."

hehe its Balamory but Polyamoury sounds better!!
lol

Never will anyone from here listen to that song in quite the same way again lol

Quote by fruity1976
I always thought it was polygamy?? Or is that a different thing again. I think people should have the right to do anything they want as long is its not harming anyone else.

I believe that polygamy is the term used to describe a relationship where a person is married to more than one person at a time, currently illegal under UK law with exceptions for some religious/cultural groups.

Quote by fruity1976
I dont think Id be into it myself but then my reasons are I find it hard enough at times having relationships with singular people nevermind full time relationships with more than one person. Mebbie Im just selfish but I like my own space too much or maybe thats just my attitude because of previous relationships.
But who knows really? If you did happen to meet two people you felt you could share your life with equally and you had a strong bond and all are happy! Why not!

It actually works quite well for cultures that allow it (married wise) Thing is the cultures that do allow it only allow multiple wifes, now while we may feel that the very same cultures are, to a degree, oppressive to women per-say, should a man neglect or find specific favour with one wife more than another then he becomes disgraced in the eyes of his peers.
I can see many "humorous" reasons a poly lifestyle would be good or bad, such as lots of sex, more than one mother-in0law etc... but on a serious side I can see some benifits as two wifes who got on would have a friend on tap, the day to day pressures that are present in any long term 1-1 relationship would be reduced as there would always be someone else to help and so on... more so with time, as obviously any relationship in the early stages is more about the immediate passion of the relationship, its the long term when the things that brought you together start to become the things that annoy that is one of the major destructive factors with a 1-1 relationship.

7 Sep 2004

Boy this is a heavy one. I've read most of it and nearly drowned in the words. I think the amount of words (measured in kilos) is an indication of how difficult it is to draw a line between some closely related topics, which when all is said and done are subjective anyway - so whatever grabs you baby!

9 Sep 2004

For the interested minority:-

Not much on here as yet but could become a good site if used by enough people.
Roger