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Quote by postie
And before you reply wishmaster....
I have been thinking.... YOU are wrong on so many levels it is beyond belief. Your argument is bollocks. Your opinion is bollocks and I don't give a rats arse about any kind of justification you may come out with.
That's how stupidly wrong you are.
( why didn't i write that first time?? dunno )

:thumbup:
Quote by postie
And the bigotry continues

Jesus Christ!!! ( 3rd prophet in Islam.....)
And we invaded Iraq!!! (yep.... we did, illegally...)
Iran have nuclear capabilities, (erm.... nope, that's what all the hoo-ha is about at the moment...and even that is about domestic nuclear power not nuclear weapons)
appauling human rights record( check it out.. not as bad as you think...not brilliant, but certainly not as bad as say Saudi Arabia, who are on our side)
and radical murderous religious groups! ( is George Bush and the religious, pro-death sentence Baptists working in Iran now? )
No oil though... ( erm... wrong... massive amount of oil, almost as much oil as Iraq, and better refineries )
evil
biggrin
Agree on every single point lol - touche! wink
What i meant was, Iraq was the central power in terms of oil - so breaking into that directly opens up all the other avenues over time.
I'm beginning to notice increasing amounts of media about Iran; which suggests to me that the government is trying to soften the public for a future Iranian invasion.
Its all a game of chess! Highly illegal chess!
Quote by Happy Cats

It's been assumed in this thread that I am bi myself - ok - now the subject has been raised I'll answer it, yes I am. Not many people know my sexuality because I choose not to advertise it - it's my business, yet on occasion in the chat room where it has been mentioned one or two people have been shocked and casually remarked "Wishy, is there something you're not telling us" - all tongue-in-cheek and I treated it as such, but still it remains no-one's business but mine. ...... hehehe

But the question is - do you take it up the shitter?
lol
:lol2: :lol2:
you are such a nutter
Quote by JudyTV

It's been assumed in this thread that I am bi myself - ok - now the subject has been raised I'll answer it, yes I am. Not many people know my sexuality because I choose not to advertise it - it's my business, yet on occasion in the chat room where it has been mentioned one or two people have been shocked and casually remarked "Wishy, is there something you're not telling us" - all tongue-in-cheek and I treated it as such, but still it remains no-one's business but mine. ...... hehehe

But the question is - do you take it up the shitter?
lol
Mind your own fookin business!!! :lol:
Quote by Wishmaster
Mind your own fookin business!!! lol

Wishy you might be laughing but I hope you realise how many people you have offended today with your postings rolleyes
You are not at all the person I thought you were sad
I don't believe for one minute that you can dig yourself all the way back out your hole, only time will tell dunno
Quote by seagull69
I think they should all be shot. I hate them!
They're loud and serve no purpose, get rid of em all, each and everyone, string em up!
Sod their rights!
I bloody hate seagulls!

There are times Happy Cats... you really, really cheer me up...!!!
Thank you.
CheekyChimp..... cool
Oi I have rights you know :sparring:
Well stop crapping on me fecking car then !!! :grin:
Quote by Dawn_Mids
Mind your own fookin business!!! lol

Wishy you might be laughing but I hope you realise how many people you have offended today with your postings rolleyes
You are not at all the person I thought you were sad
I don't believe for one minute that you can dig yourself all the way back out your hole, only time will tell dunno
The truth sometimes hurts Dawn .. I see things for how they really are. i'm not going to open this thing up again... what's been said has been said .... I've seen it before and not just on here..... I have a different viewpoint than others and have been slammed for it as ignorant and niave..... I've been out in the world and seen a lot of it's nastiness..... I've seen hypocrisy and I've seen how people are fooled by well wishers who have their own hidden agendas...... as a result... I trust very few people and those I do trust have earned it.
If ppl want to dislike me for having the balls to stand up and say what I feel then so be it..... I don't need friends who judge me on the contents of one thread . I have 000's more posts in here that have made ppl laugh, have made them cry too I suspect .... those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today. I'm not interested in shallow people who like me one minute then slam me the next .... I like real friends not part time ones.
Quote by Him'nHer
I think they should all be shot. I hate them!
They're loud and serve no purpose, get rid of em all, each and everyone, string em up!
Sod their rights!
I bloody hate seagulls!

There are times Happy Cats... you really, really cheer me up...!!!
Thank you.
CheekyChimp..... cool
Oi I have rights you know :sparring:
Well stop crapping on me fecking car then !!! :grin:
I have every right to crap on your car. It is what comes natural to me lol
Quote by Wishmaster
The truth sometimes hurts Dawn .. I see things for how they really are. i'm not going to open this thing up again... what's been said has been said .... I've seen it before and not just on here..... I have a different viewpoint than others and have been slammed for it as ignorant and niave..... I've been out in the world and seen a lot of it's nastiness..... I've seen hypocrisy and I've seen how people are fooled by well wishers who have their own hidden agendas...... as a result... I trust very few people and those I do trust have earned it.
If ppl want to dislike me for having the balls to stand up and say what I feel then so be it..... I don't need friends who judge me on the contents of one thread . I have 000's more posts in here that have made ppl laugh, have made them cry too I suspect .... those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today. I'm not interested in shallow people who like me one minute then slam me the next .... I like real friends not part time ones.

I'm so glad I wasn't your friend, just someone who I've spoken with in the chatroom.
For the record, it wasn't necessarily your opinion I am find so appalling but more so the way you put it across rolleyes
Quote by Wishmaster
those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today.

Its a pity they couldn't have supported you openly.
I for one never send PMs to people saying anything i wouldn't say on the forum, if i have somethng to say then i say it and yes i know i have offened people in the past but thats life i suppose.
But a true friend stands by you wink
Quote by Wishmaster
Mind your own fookin business!!! lol

Wishy you might be laughing but I hope you realise how many people you have offended today with your postings rolleyes
You are not at all the person I thought you were sad
I don't believe for one minute that you can dig yourself all the way back out your hole, only time will tell dunno
The truth sometimes hurts Dawn .. I see things for how they really are. i'm not going to open this thing up again... what's been said has been said .... I've seen it before and not just on here..... I have a different viewpoint than others and have been slammed for it as ignorant and niave..... I've been out in the world and seen a lot of it's nastiness..... I've seen hypocrisy and I've seen how people are fooled by well wishers who have their own hidden agendas...... as a result... I trust very few people and those I do trust have earned it.
If ppl want to dislike me for having the balls to stand up and say what I feel then so be it..... I don't need friends who judge me on the contents of one thread . I have 000's more posts in here that have made ppl laugh, have made them cry too I suspect .... those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today. I'm not interested in shallow people who like me one minute then slam me the next .... I like real friends not part time ones.

Thing is, the ones that you think made them laugh, made them cry, and the ones you think made cry, made them...............................
You get the picture!
:lol: :lol:
just a quick note to say.....new book launch next week at SH towers
personal autograph copies will be available.
"how to make friends and influence people"....author... WISHMASTER
hey but hurry they will be selling fast !!!
Quote by seagull69
I think they should all be shot. I hate them!
They're loud and serve no purpose, get rid of em all, each and everyone, string em up!
Sod their rights!
I bloody hate seagulls!

There are times Happy Cats... you really, really cheer me up...!!!
Thank you.
CheekyChimp..... cool
Oi I have rights you know :sparring:
Well stop crapping on me fecking car then !!! :grin:
I have every right to crap on your car. It is what comes natural to me lol
HUH :grin:
Quote by Wishmaster
[I've seen hypocrisy:

Mostly in your own posts. confused
Are you going to enter your "shitter" on the rear of the year thread?
Quote by Wishmaster
I have a different viewpoint than others and have been slammed for it as ignorant and niave..... I've been out in the world and seen a lot of it's nastiness..... I've seen hypocrisy and I've seen how people are fooled by well wishers who have their own hidden agendas...... as a result... I trust very few people and those I do trust have earned it.

That reads as very presumptious ... as though you are the only one on this thread who has experience of "the world". I think many people that have argued their case very eloquently will have had equal experience of the world and it's nastiness but not have been affected by it in the way that you seem to have been.
Quote by Wishmaster
I don't need friends who judge me on the contents of one thread . I have 000's more posts in here that have made ppl laugh, have made them cry too I suspect .... those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today. I'm not interested in shallow people who like me one minute then slam me the next .... I like real friends not part time ones.

Well, I'm not your friend as I have never met you in person. I can thus only judge you baed on what you have written on the forum. Until this thread I can't say I had an opinion about you, one way or another.... you were just a reg who's posts I read, and yes, sometimes your posts make me laugh. However, what you have written in this thread has appalled me. You have upset people, straight and bi alike.... Your inclusion of information about people's personal lives pertaining to their experiences of domestic violence was particularly distasteful and I have to say, downright disgraceful.
I have no time for shallow people either, but I'm afraid that your attempts at humour in the face of such serious subjects like homophobia, domestic violence and have come over as nothing more than shallow at best, and at worst, callous. I sincerely hope you are secretly ashamed at yourself and your attempts at humour of been merely a method to cover up that shame. An open apology to all those you've offended might be good right now btw.
Yes, people are entitled to voice their opinions, but when such opinion is based on a lack of understanding of fact, and when such opinion has obviously upset so many, I think it is time to shut up.
A shovel will not dig you out of this one. A JCB might do the job a little quicker.
Quote by Dawn_Mids
The truth sometimes hurts Dawn .. I see things for how they really are. i'm not going to open this thing up again... what's been said has been said .... I've seen it before and not just on here..... I have a different viewpoint than others and have been slammed for it as ignorant and niave..... I've been out in the world and seen a lot of it's nastiness..... I've seen hypocrisy and I've seen how people are fooled by well wishers who have their own hidden agendas...... as a result... I trust very few people and those I do trust have earned it.
If ppl want to dislike me for having the balls to stand up and say what I feel then so be it..... I don't need friends who judge me on the contents of one thread . I have 000's more posts in here that have made ppl laugh, have made them cry too I suspect .... those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today. I'm not interested in shallow people who like me one minute then slam me the next .... I like real friends not part time ones.

I'm so glad I wasn't your friend, just someone who I've spoken with in the chatroom.
For the record, it wasn't necessarily your opinion I am find so appalling but more so the way you put it across rolleyes
I agree with Dawn. Except I did think of you as a friend and now feel that I'm one of those you "aren't interested in". All I tried to do today is put another point of view across, with what I felt were reasoned arguments (most of which you've chosen to ignore btw) and after some of the private conversations that you and I have had in the chatroom I find it quite hurtful to be lumped in with the "shallow people". You know what though? I won't be losing any sleep over it because I like me, and I'd much prefer to have my open and accepting mind than a closed mind and really quite insulting demeanour.
And for the record, I hadn't considered myself to have fallen out with you until this post, but now I've come to the conclusion that I really don't need friends who can insult me the minute I don't agree with something they've said
Quote by bluexxx
I don't need friends who judge me on the contents of one thread . I have 000's more posts in here that have made ppl laugh, have made them cry too I suspect .... those people have told me privately that they agree with the things I have said in here today.... those are the people I shall remember after today. I'm not interested in shallow people who like me one minute then slam me the next .... I like real friends not part time ones.

Well, I'm not your friend as I have never met you in person. I can thus only judge you baed on what you have written on the forum. Until this thread I can't say I had an opinion about you, one way or another.... you were just a reg who's posts I read, and yes, sometimes your posts make me laugh. However, what you have written in this thread has appalled me. You have upset people, straight and bi alike.... Your inclusion of information about people's personal lives pertaining to their experiences of domestic violence was particularly distasteful and I have to say, downright disgraceful.
I have no time for shallow people either, but I'm afraid that your attempts at humour in the face of such serious subjects like homophobia, domestic violence and have come over as nothing more than shallow at best, and at worst, callous. I sincerely hope you are secretly ashamed at yourself and your attempts at humour of been merely a method to cover up that shame. An open apology to all those you've offended might be good right now btw.
Yes, people are entitled to voice their opinions, but when such opinion is based on a lack of understanding of fact, and when such opinion has obviously upset so many, I think it is time to shut up.
A shovel will not dig you out of this one. A JCB might do the job a little quicker.
Nah.... dont think I'll bother..... the PC Brigade will soon find someone else to hang..... they thrive on it..... won't be posting in The Cafe again .... cyas. xxx
Quote by Wishmaster
Nah.... dont think I'll bother..... the PC Brigade will soon find someone else to hang..... they thrive on it..... won't be posting in The Cafe again .... cyas. xxx

Angel watches the flounce with little or no surprise. wave
Quote by Wishmaster
won't be posting in The Cafe again .... cyas. xxx

Oh... a flounce.......... how very original....... and how very mature ---- not.
rolleyes
Quote by Angel Chat

Nah.... dont think I'll bother..... the PC Brigade will soon find someone else to hang..... they thrive on it..... won't be posting in The Cafe again .... cyas. xxx

Angel watches the flounce with little or no surprise. wave
:wave:
Quote by Angel Chat

Nah.... dont think I'll bother..... the PC Brigade will soon find someone else to hang..... they thrive on it..... won't be posting in The Cafe again .... cyas. xxx

Angel watches the flounce with little or no surprise. wave
At the risk of sounding even more Scouse than usual - "calm down!"
I think if this was a normal thread it'd be blocked by now - its serving no other purpose than to upset people!
People agree and disagree AND discuss how they disagree and agree - but there has to be a point were people just calm down and take things in their stride!
Come on people the forum is about fun and meeting new people - but not getting wound up and pre-judging people based on what they post on a forum!
You can't accurately guage what people say by reading a transcript of the conversation - you need to talk to people face to face.
Just get along, chat at munches and make judgements then and, until then, have fun!!!
See there you go again making assumptions. Wishmaster and I have met several times and up until now have always got on.
Quote by Angel Chat
See there you go again making assumptions. Wishmaster and I have met several times and up until now have always got on.

Whoops! redface surprisedops: :oops:
Sorry i didn't mean to quote!
I've just done it alot tonight on different threads and i'm still useless at it!!!
Nah i just meant in general Angel!
Whoops.... :shock:
Quote by Wishmaster
won't be posting in The Cafe again ...

Thats probably the best thing you've said all day rolleyes
Quote by JudyTV

It's been assumed in this thread that I am bi myself - ok - now the subject has been raised I'll answer it, yes I am. Not many people know my sexuality because I choose not to advertise it - it's my business, yet on occasion in the chat room where it has been mentioned one or two people have been shocked and casually remarked "Wishy, is there something you're not telling us" - all tongue-in-cheek and I treated it as such, but still it remains no-one's business but mine. ...... hehehe

But the question is - do you take it up the shitter?
lol
Mind your own fookin business!!! :lol:
:laughabove: :laughabove:
Oh dear. A blatant misquote from Wishmaster. It wasn't me who said it / quoted it. Not having a great day with that big spade are you?
Judy! That was terrible of you!
Quote by Wishmaster
In answer to Sassy's post (and you know I like you as a person Sassy, we've had many a giggle in the chat room so this isn't personal ok).
Sorry Sassy hon, I'm not having a go at you at all, your posts have been eloquent and well thought out and you have made some very valid points

Wishy I didn't take it personally or as you having a go, I enjoyed the debate and on this particular issue have a wealth of experience to back up my views. I am still convinced your wrong tho! lol
I've been hurt by too many comments on this posting to even begin to mention. All the points have gone across explained and explained again form all sides.
I don't believe that these postings were about the marches themselves at all but to why they are around. We no longer have womens rights day because we all believe women have equal rights. This happened because of change and teaching the society.
I for one agree that change is good within all societies. Not just in societies either, as the ability but to change quickly and effortlessly is the sign of a well run society (business talk).
In one way I think Wishmaster is trying to explain that our (the UK) is very diverse and able to adapt and change well. So much so that these celebrations (I like to call them acknowledgements as this is less likely to cause trouble) to being within a pigeon hole lgbt, pride or any other sexually orientated march is not needed to the extent that is happening. The UK shouldn't need marches to accept the rights of others!
In the past these marchs have gotten rights, equal treatment and being socially equal too. I know that womens rights are still being over looked for job prospects, equal pay and even promotional aspects. The same goes for differents colours and abilities. This is a reason why these marches went on and hopefully given a few more years all predjudice will be gone forever. (fingers crossed).
What I am reading about the sexuality marches is a bit different. You can not define anybody what sexuality they are by a) looking at them b) asking them. These can change on a yearly/monthly/daily/hourly basis. It was easier for all the other marches because they could be easily be accounted for. "Are you a woman? yes then you are now allowed this this and this." You can not ask somebody regarding the sexual preference because as wishy put it, it is not your business. In my eyes these marches are done purely for the social acceptance.
Once accepted then there will be no need to 'encourage' the confused as they will have the strength in themselves to make there own choices without the pressure from outside influences. It is the fight to get them that courage that is happening at the moment, not the fight to convert or push their beliefs down your throat. Society is a hard thing to influence and above all teach.
I am sorry Wishy but I do not believe the UK or anywhere else in the World has the ability to accept change as quick as you would like. It would be good if they could but at the moment it would take a long time for any changes.
I truely hope I understood and read between the lines of your postings.
before the dust settles just like to add I have 2 gay brothers-in-law who do feel proud of their sexuality but don't agree with the gay pride movement. They tell me its because of the peter tatchell thing in the eighties and the movement being based in socialism. Oh yeah their both fully paid up members of the tory party. So wishy does this mean their ok
A bit late back into the fray but Really pissed off about the comments on domestic violence. I have to agree with others that have been in that position. And how many times have you been a victim of that then WM? No? Then don't make ridiculous comments taht are not supported by experience or fact.
Being part of domestic viiolence is not only about the physical pain but the complete and utter demolition of you as a person - slowly and carefully, you are eroded until you are nothing, no pride, no confidence, slow and painful death of the person you once were. And boy are they good at it - so slow you don't even know it's happening.
I can't even express how debilitated a person becomes, how dependant they become on this shit who is abusing them. So how does anyone walk out on someone when they haveno faith in themselves, when they truly believe that are to blame for all of this happening . . . .? It;s bloody hard and each of us fuinally reach that point when something says enough. I only wish it had been sooner for us all.
And another point about disabled people . . . you reckon they just get up and get on with it? Ah life is simple in your world then? Must remember to tell my son that . . .just get up and get on with it kid!