Would you shoot your gun at me too?? :giggle: Join the most popular community of UK swingers now
Login
Self defence
Sex God
As I understand it, reasonable is seen as enough force to remove them (still living) from the premises. If you can't do that manually, threatening them or hitting them with a weapon is acceptable. Hiding behind the sofa and blowing their heads off without giving them warning or chance to get out is seen as unreasonable.
Shooting them is a real problem for defining reasonable generally.
If your life or that of another person (especially kids) is directly threatened, killing or maiming the perpetrator might be accepted as reasonable in a court but you'd be hard pressed to get a serving police officer to say that anywhere near a mike
Either way, you're likely to end up charged and have to answer for your actions.
Shooting them is a real problem for defining reasonable generally.
If your life or that of another person (especially kids) is directly threatened, killing or maiming the perpetrator might be accepted as reasonable in a court but you'd be hard pressed to get a serving police officer to say that anywhere near a mike
Either way, you're likely to end up charged and have to answer for your actions.
Sex God
Quote by flower411
As I understand it, reasonable is seen as enough force to remove them (still living) from the premises. If you can't do that manually, threatening them or hitting them with a weapon is acceptable. Hiding behind the sofa and blowing their heads off without giving them warning or chance to get out is seen as unreasonable.
Shooting them is a real problem for defining reasonable generally.
If your life or that of another person (especially kids) is directly threatened, killing or maiming the perpetrator might be accepted as reasonable in a court but you'd be hard pressed to get a serving police officer to say that anywhere near a mike
Either way, you're likely to end up charged and have to answer for your actions.
Just have to make sure Mike ain`t there !!!
hmm, me, Mike and a uniformed police officer - sounds like an excellent night :D
Sex God
OK for a start "breaking into a home" and "attacking us" are two very different situations. In the latter there's a direct threat to life so it warrants a completely different approach. In the former someone is trying to steal property and at the end of it all, it's just stuff that can probably be replaced (TV DVD etc) they're not interested (in the main) in anything that's of sentimental value to you, they just want a quick "in and out" (don't we all :lol2: )
Being attacked is a whole different ball game, especially if the attacker is armed, but you do still have to remain in control of your emotions as subduing an attacker and then kicking seven shades out of them is definitely an assault against them, even if they had a weapon to start with.
Reasonable force is enough force to escape from immediate threat or danger or enough to subdue the attacker. Any more and you probably will find yourself on the wrong side of the dock.
TBH I have to deal with people who can be extremely violent every day and as a result I have to be acutely aware of where the legal lines are drawn.
Being attacked is a whole different ball game, especially if the attacker is armed, but you do still have to remain in control of your emotions as subduing an attacker and then kicking seven shades out of them is definitely an assault against them, even if they had a weapon to start with.
Reasonable force is enough force to escape from immediate threat or danger or enough to subdue the attacker. Any more and you probably will find yourself on the wrong side of the dock.
TBH I have to deal with people who can be extremely violent every day and as a result I have to be acutely aware of where the legal lines are drawn.
Sex God
Quote by easy
TBH I have to deal with people who can be extremely violent every day and as a result I have to be acutely aware of where the legal lines are drawn.
Blimey - I know the chatrooms can get a bit lively on a Saturday night - but I never reckoned they got that rough
Sex God
There is a difference in what I guess would transpire if you woke up in the middle of the night. Whichever of the following was occurring 'should' be what determines your actions.
Robbery:- Law. the felonious taking of the property of another from his or her person or in his or her immediate presence, against his or her will, by violence or intimidation.
Burglary:- The felony of breaking into and entering the house of another at night with intent to steal, extended by statute to cover the breaking into and entering of any of various buildings, by night or day.
In the first instance one would assume you have the right to violently defend yourself. Where as in the second you would not.
In saying that I don't know how I would react if awoken at night. I would probably grab the nearest thing to hit out with regardless because I would be cra**ing myself :shock:
Robbery:- Law. the felonious taking of the property of another from his or her person or in his or her immediate presence, against his or her will, by violence or intimidation.
Burglary:- The felony of breaking into and entering the house of another at night with intent to steal, extended by statute to cover the breaking into and entering of any of various buildings, by night or day.
In the first instance one would assume you have the right to violently defend yourself. Where as in the second you would not.
In saying that I don't know how I would react if awoken at night. I would probably grab the nearest thing to hit out with regardless because I would be cra**ing myself :shock:
Sex God
The law generally allows a person to use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances for the purposes of self-defence. Similar rules apply to defence of someone else or defending property from an unlawful act.
However, there is no easy definition of what force is reasonable:
it is a matter to be decided in each individual case. That is because self-defence is governed by the common law - the accumulated wisdom of the courts as expressed in decided cases.
There is already a statute setting out how much force can be used to prevent crime or to arrest offenders. But the Criminal Justice Act 1967 says no more than that a person "may use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances". In reality, it would be impossible to list all the circumstances in which the courts would regard force as reasonable.
BLAH BLAH FECKIN BLAH….. BOLLOX
Rule of thumb as told to me by a leading prosecutor only a few months ago:
If a scumbag enters your home unlawfully, he’s already on a sticky wicket.
If said scumbag is armed in any way, he’s in the shit.
That said there seems to be some kind of unwritten sliding scale, I.e. :
If scumbag threatens you or anyone within your household and you are in fear of your life, or someone else’s, the level of self defence deemed ‘acceptable ‘can increase by leaps and bounds.
For instance, if the guy comes at you with a tyre lever and you beat his brains out with a baseball bat that just happened to be hanging around, the chances of you getting prosecuted are minimal.
If on the other hand the guy is coming at you with a slightly squishy banana and you take him out with a small thermo nuclear device, prepare to spend some time behind bars. Extreme examples I know, just trying to inject a little
here, but the gist of what I’m saying holds true, or so I’ve been told.
So, it seems that as long as the threat to you, in your opinion, at the time, makes you feel that your own or someone else’s life is in danger, you are pretty well insured against state backlash.
**** please be aware that the scumbag may still be able to bring a private prosecution against you and that we are fighting hard through lobby to get this practise outlawed. ****
Personally, (and for the record these are my personal opinions) I really don’t give a shit. If someone enters my home uninvited with the perceived intent of doing my family harm, or with the intent of depriving me, or my loved ones of their hard earned possessions, I will do all in my power to remove that life form from this planet so that no other family has to go through the same trauma.
I will argue my case in court as best I can but will happily accept a prison term in the sure and certain knowledge that I have done a service to my family and my community.
And before all the bleeding hearts get on their soap boxes, the (imaginary) guy made a choice, how ever bad his situation, he / she had a choice not to enter my home, would I regret taking his / her life? …..
NOT FOR AN INSTANCE
At the end of the day, when all is counted and calculated, I would rather be tried by twelve than carried by six.
Both barrels every time :thumbup:
The views expressed in this post are the views of the poster and have no reflection on the policies, views or opinions of the site owners or members.
Caveat emptor :lol2:
However, there is no easy definition of what force is reasonable:
it is a matter to be decided in each individual case. That is because self-defence is governed by the common law - the accumulated wisdom of the courts as expressed in decided cases.
There is already a statute setting out how much force can be used to prevent crime or to arrest offenders. But the Criminal Justice Act 1967 says no more than that a person "may use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances". In reality, it would be impossible to list all the circumstances in which the courts would regard force as reasonable.
BLAH BLAH FECKIN BLAH….. BOLLOX
Rule of thumb as told to me by a leading prosecutor only a few months ago:
If a scumbag enters your home unlawfully, he’s already on a sticky wicket.
If said scumbag is armed in any way, he’s in the shit.
That said there seems to be some kind of unwritten sliding scale, I.e. :
If scumbag threatens you or anyone within your household and you are in fear of your life, or someone else’s, the level of self defence deemed ‘acceptable ‘can increase by leaps and bounds.
For instance, if the guy comes at you with a tyre lever and you beat his brains out with a baseball bat that just happened to be hanging around, the chances of you getting prosecuted are minimal.
If on the other hand the guy is coming at you with a slightly squishy banana and you take him out with a small thermo nuclear device, prepare to spend some time behind bars. Extreme examples I know, just trying to inject a little
here, but the gist of what I’m saying holds true, or so I’ve been told.So, it seems that as long as the threat to you, in your opinion, at the time, makes you feel that your own or someone else’s life is in danger, you are pretty well insured against state backlash.
**** please be aware that the scumbag may still be able to bring a private prosecution against you and that we are fighting hard through lobby to get this practise outlawed. ****
Personally, (and for the record these are my personal opinions) I really don’t give a shit. If someone enters my home uninvited with the perceived intent of doing my family harm, or with the intent of depriving me, or my loved ones of their hard earned possessions, I will do all in my power to remove that life form from this planet so that no other family has to go through the same trauma.
I will argue my case in court as best I can but will happily accept a prison term in the sure and certain knowledge that I have done a service to my family and my community.
And before all the bleeding hearts get on their soap boxes, the (imaginary) guy made a choice, how ever bad his situation, he / she had a choice not to enter my home, would I regret taking his / her life? …..
NOT FOR AN INSTANCE
At the end of the day, when all is counted and calculated, I would rather be tried by twelve than carried by six.
Both barrels every time :thumbup:
The views expressed in this post are the views of the poster and have no reflection on the policies, views or opinions of the site owners or members.
Caveat emptor :lol2:
Reasonable force?
If you are attacked, any force that you use must cease when the attackers turns and moves away, unless it is to subdue the attacker.
So if a man points a gun or weapon at you and you feel that you or others are in danger, then you can shot him. If he then drops the weapon, putting another in the head is murder.
If he is running away you may hold and restrain him until you can turn him over to the police at the earliest possible moment.
What you do you will have to justify your actions.
If you are a police officer and kill a man who has just shot five men and reloading to shot seven more bond and blindfolded you can look forward the a criminal trail. Some people are held to higher standards.
Travis
If you are attacked, any force that you use must cease when the attackers turns and moves away, unless it is to subdue the attacker.
So if a man points a gun or weapon at you and you feel that you or others are in danger, then you can shot him. If he then drops the weapon, putting another in the head is murder.
If he is running away you may hold and restrain him until you can turn him over to the police at the earliest possible moment.
What you do you will have to justify your actions.
If you are a police officer and kill a man who has just shot five men and reloading to shot seven more bond and blindfolded you can look forward the a criminal trail. Some people are held to higher standards.
Travis
My old school TKD instructor would have me in stitches with his "caveats."
EG, "...........however, before you perform said move, please ensure you have the shell of a Biro, or a straw handy- as once you have ripped out his/her windpipe you will need to perform an emergency Tracheotomy"
EG, "...........however, before you perform said move, please ensure you have the shell of a Biro, or a straw handy- as once you have ripped out his/her windpipe you will need to perform an emergency Tracheotomy"
Sex God
To be honest I wouldn't bother reporting the crime...
A good kicking would be dished out......Bundeled into the boot and then dropped off about 20 miles away...
Job Done
A good kicking would be dished out......Bundeled into the boot and then dropped off about 20 miles away...
Job Done
Sex God
Quote by winchwench
In response to Pete SW
you promised to tell us about 'pointed sticks' :giggle:
Mod
I don't really know much about self defence .
But I can tell you a true story about my friend who lives in South Africa.
A few years ago he heard a noise during the night and went downstairs to find a guy in his house. He took out his gun and shot him dead there and then and then he shot the wall.
When the police came he said "I fired a warning shot at the wall but he still came at me so I had to shoot him."
He got away scot free with what is basically murder so was he right to do it or wrong?
.But I can tell you a true story about my friend who lives in South Africa.
A few years ago he heard a noise during the night and went downstairs to find a guy in his house. He took out his gun and shot him dead there and then and then he shot the wall.
When the police came he said "I fired a warning shot at the wall but he still came at me so I had to shoot him."
He got away scot free with what is basically murder so was he right to do it or wrong?
Quote by woohoo
I don't really know much about self defence
But I can tell you a true story about my friend who lives in South Africa.
A few years ago he heard a noise during the night and went downstairs to find a guy in his house. He took out his gun and shot him dead there and then and then he shot the wall.
When the police came he said "I fired a warning shot at the wall but he still came at me so I had to shoot him."
He got away scot free with what is basically murder so was he right to do it or wrong?
it sounds like cold blooded murder to me...if he knew that a warning shot could have sent the intruder packing...but decided to kill him and cover up his tracks by firing at the wall...then i believe he was in the wrong.
Mod
But how would he have known a warning shot would have made the guy run away??
Sex God
I had an eleven year old in my old house break in during the day with me in bed upstairs in bed off shift. I should of shot him dead right there and then . The curtains where closed and it was dim. Oh dear sorry and all
What a result that would of been .....NOT
What a result that would of been
.....NOT Mod
God forbod lost.
It would be like hanging the wrong person and that has never hapened of course
It would be like hanging the wrong person and that has never hapened of course
Quote by woohoo
But how would he have known a warning shot would have made the guy run away??
well he knew a warning shot was the proper thing to do,thats why he did it after to cover up the fact he killed someone in coldblood...as for the intruder yeah he might not have runaway but he would have had a choice to do so.
if like those morons i mean americans we were allowed to arm ourselves...could anyone honestly believe they could pull the trigger on an intruder if they were not in immediate danger.
Quote by browning
Some people may say killing a burglar is over reacting but my opinion is that if the burglar was'nt breaking into my house I would not have killed.
I believe that when you commit crime you give up your human rights to be treated fairly.
does that go for speeding,going through red lights,watching pirate movies,downloading music illegally and lots of other things we do on a daily basis which could be considered breaking the law.
I think most people forget the fact that you are only going to take someone down when you know you can do it. Whatever the circumstances, you have the upper hand and are supposed to be able to exercise the difference between the humane and the barbaric.
The barbarian is judged and found guilty, the humanitarian, is left to suffer in silence.
The barbarian is judged and found guilty, the humanitarian, is left to suffer in silence.
Quote by browning
Some people may say killing a burglar is over reacting but my opinion is that if the burglar was'nt breaking into my house I would not have killed him.
I believe that when you commit crime you give up your human rights to be treated fairly.
How about saying "If you commit a crime, any you are responsible for any resulting situation."
ie. Adam breaks in, Adam is shot by Eve, Adam is prosecuted for wounding. Eve can be tried as well, but could be deemed to be acting reasonable. Adam could not be. Adam could in fact be charged with anything, including murder of Eve due to a heart-act. I think I could like such a law.
Sex God
Quote by
Some people may say killing a burglar is over reacting but my opinion is that if the burglar was'nt breaking into my house I would not have killed him.
I believe that when you commit crime you give up your human rights to be treated fairly.
How about saying "If you commit a crime, any you are responsible for any resulting situation."
ie. Adam breaks in, Adam is shot by Eve, Adam is prosecuted for wounding. Eve can be tried as well, but could be deemed to be acting reasonable. Adam could not be. Adam could in fact be charged with anything, including murder of Eve due to a heart-act. I think I could like such a law.
As I understand it (and I'm happy to be corrected on this) - if you commit a federal offence in the USA and someone dies in the process - you can be tried for murder. Even if the death would normally be considered an accident (like you knock them over as you run away and they bang their head and die).
If that's true then I like that law.
