Quote by GnV
Dont believe all you read in the imakeitupmail ben, particularly from such pressure groups
He has to Blue, he's their chief correspondent
:laughabove::laughabove::laughabove::laughabove::laughabove:

Quote by Staggerlee_BB
curiously of all the dogs I met over the last weekend only one had an injured tail ... a spaniel with a docked tail
Quote by GnV
The planning laws have been revised some what now, Thanks to pressure groups.
Quote by Ben_Minx
I got a proof for ya. Is the insurance premium for a docked dog less than for an intact one? It isnt, therefore the risk reduction is minimal.
Quote by NEEDFORFUN
we have 5 working border collies and a jack russell. none are docked and we can't see why they should be, they all work hard and seem to be able to keep thier talls under control.
the only dog we have had in the family that was docked was our old english, but that was done before we got her and purely because the kennel club said the breed looked better docked. i say "bollocks ". most docking was, and to an extent, still is being done because the kennel club has historically said "that is how the breed should look.
there is no medical reason for it. people cut thier fingers so, should we all have them cut off at birth?
Quote by starlightcouple
That because peeple use them for hunting and are fine with there dog ripping another animal to pieces, but are sympathetic towards it hurting its tail in the process of that action
Quote by starlightcouple
sorry but as much as i like bluefish and his threads, he is looking at things from a country boys way of life. to a city boy like myself any form of hunting is barbaric, and i still beleeve that the docking of a dogs tail is for the practise of hunting and that entails. nothing i have read in this thread will convince me otherwise. the only sympathy i am leaning towards is the poor little dog whilst having its tail cut off.
Quote by Staggerlee_BB
I got a proof for ya. Is the insurance premium for a docked dog less than for an intact one? It isnt, therefore the risk reduction is minimal.
Quote by Ben_Minx
I got a proof for ya. Is the insurance premium for a docked dog less than for an intact one? It isnt, therefore the risk reduction is minimal.
Quote by Staggerlee_BB
a dog is a dog is a dog Staggs.
I don't have one but did many many years ago. She was a labrador.
she injured her paw once on a family walk through the woods. We weren't hunting, or beating or anything like that but nonetheless, she injured her paw. Dogs go roaming about and get into difficulties.
Before you ask, she didn't have her paw amputated but I can see where Blue is coming from on this. You expose your dog to risks by walking it down the street near your home. You are duty bound imho to do what you can to minimise the possibility of injuring it.
In our case, we took her choke chain off in the woods or other open areas so she might not be strangled if it (the choke chain) got caught on a fence, tree branch - whatever. The paw injury was probably as a result of some mindless moron breaking a glass bottle, or something similar. It didn't matter at the time.
Some dogs are working animals. That's what they are bred for. There is no escaping that fact.
Docking a working dog's tail so that it is not injured in circumstances where the risk is high that it might is an act of sensibility, not cruelty.
You are not now going to persuade me to an alternate view. Sincere apologies.
Quote by starlightcouple
Why would I wish to be cruel to my dog?
Quote by GnV
Maybe star, but it's old hat now. GB is writing his memoirs and spending time on the US speaking circuit.
There's nothing wrong with defying Brussels. Ship the evil buggers out on the first available flight. When the deed is done and dusted, you can't ship the evil bastards back.
Like him or lump him, M. le Président Sarkozy did just that with the Roma when they started shooting Policemen and rioting in the south of France.
Liberalist groups in the European Parliament and the Commission where aghast at the action and threatened the Président and France with sanctions.
Did it come to anything? Absolutely not. M. Sarkozy told them not only where to stick their fingers but how many at a time and nothing more was said.
That's how to deal with the Commission. Ignore the fooking, insignificant, self opinionated prats.
Agree with you about Maggie though; Her "non! non! non!" in the House all those years ago after Jaques Delors said he wanted the European Parliament to be the democratic body of the Community, the Commission to be the Executive and the Council of Ministers to be the Senate did wonders for Britain's self-esteem.
Quote by starlightcouple
just as a question blue.
dobermans and rotties used to have there tails docked. can you answer me as to why they did? was it for medicle reesons, or through the work the dog does? or as i suspect purely for the purpose of making that breed look better, and every other dog of that breed is. also a dog say a boxer without a docked tail, would have been worth less money. true or false?
also dogs use their tails to communicate with other dogs (and with people).
.
Quote by starlightcouple
just as a question blue.
sorry but it is nothing short of mutilation, and any other reeson than that is an unjustifiable excuse for cruelty and self importance.
Quote by GnV
I assume you mean these reasons Blue .... so a small number of dogs sustain tail injuries whilst working (a very small number) therefore all working dogs should have their tails docked .... a small number of dogs break their legs whilst working (leading to amputation) should all dogs then have their legs amputated as a precaution??
Blue I am a trustee of a dog rescue and have just returned from the N.E.S.S.R. Easter dog show (that's a Springer rescue organisation of which I am a member ) I do have a little knowledge myself ... and in my experience the docking of tails when argued down to the core, boils down to 'they just don't look right with tails'
Quote by Lizaleanrob
i do wonder about kids that aren't "little shits" though do you think these are missing out on getting extra help because the unruly?
Quote by annejohn
seeing as how virtually all meat eating species,including humans,in our murky past,will take a free meal,why do you assume that sparrowhawks don't?
Quote by Ben_Minx
"
All UK legislation has now been passed and enacted as follows;
The docking of dogs' tails was banned in England from 6 April 2007 and in Wales from 28 March 2007 but with exemptions from the ban for certain working dogs, and for medical treatment. A total ban in Scotland took effect 30 April 2007
There is also a ban on the showing of docked dogs (all dogs docked after the commencement date of 6 April/28 March) at events to which members of the public are admitted on payment of a fee. However, this ban does not apply to dogs shown for the purpose of demonstrating their working ability.
The exemption for working dogs allows a dog that is likely to perform certain specified types of work to have its tail docked by a veterinary surgeon. The dog will have to be less than 5 days old and the veterinary surgeon will have to certify that he or she has seen specified evidence that the dog is likely to work in specified areas. Puppies being docked must be microchipped, either at the time of docking or when the vet considers they are old enough. The types of dog that are allowed to be docked and the types of evidence needed, is detailed below.
Puppies from certain working dogs may be docked if evidence is provided to the vet that it is likely to be worked in connection with law enforcement, activities of Her Majesty’s Armed Forces, emergency rescue, lawful pest control, or the lawful shooting of animals. It is accepted that in a litter, not all puppies docked will be found suitable for work.
"