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Lilith

Over 90 days ago

Bisexual Female, 44

UK

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26 Sep 2012

Quote by GnV
Would you mind posting links to the exact reports you're talking about? I'm curious to know what you've read in order to come to that conclusion about the officer's behaviour. I've only read/heard rather vague reports...

It was yesterday I think, a link in the Daily Telegraph (on line) or similar with a full copy of the internal report submitted by the officers concerned in to the public domain - a most unusual move if I ever saw one.
Apologies for not bothering to save it somewhere. More important fish to fry, as it were.
In edit:
Couched in typical Police-eeze and closely resembles the 'closing ranks' back-me-up-boys' non-speak often found in Magistrates Courts up and down the country. "I was proceeding in a westerly direction, sir when I came upon a person I now know to be the Government Chief Whip clutching a pair of bicycle clips......" He knew fucking damn well who he was and was being 'mischievous'.
Elsewhere, I was reminded in support of my posting about two faced Ed Miliband yet again jumping on a bandwagon, a reference to Gordon Brown's rant about a labour supporting pensioner a few years back and calling her a bigot. I don't remember Miliband calling for Brown to resign on that occasion and it was far more serious, in my humble opinion - of course!
It's all puff. Tomorrows sausage wrappers. Parliament is in recess for the conference season so the hacks are trying to keep the pot bubbling whilst they wait to hear tittle tattle about which minister is shagging so-and-so's missus etc in the back alley behind the conference hall.
Muck spreaders, all of them :lol2:
The unfortunate copper just waded in with both left feet and provided some much needed red top arse wiping material for the pubs down the old kent road for the next few days.
Thank you kiss

kiss

And, you do have a wonderful way with words... ;-)

26 Sep 2012

Quote by flower411
Steady on !!!
You`ll have Trevaunance in here complaining that you`ve gone off topic !

rotflmao

26 Sep 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
I kinda think you have picked up the workings of this forum far to quickly,and your style of posting seems to be not that of a member of only a few short months. Still if you have only been on here since April, then I admire the way you have learnt how to do the quote thingy and other things which even established forum users have struggled with.

Why, thank you. I have a rudimentary knowledge of html, which helps. But, I learn quickly and (so my wife would say) spend too much time on here! I only discovered the forums after a few months on the site. I spent most of my time in the chatrooms before that (which I still enjoy). Then, when I discovered the forums, I posted a reasonable number of posts (mostly in the cafe) as LB2012. That account has been renamed "Inanna", so if you search for that, you'll find my older posts. With hindsight, perhaps we should have created the new account for my wife, so that I didn't look quite so green! But, at least it keeps you all on your toes, eh?!

Quote by starlightcouple
you have obviously had a civil ceremony. :thumbup:

Yes, we have :-) We had our civil partnership in March, and went on our honeymoon a month ago. :-D
Nice to meet you kiss

kiss

26 Sep 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
Seems you've met your match there, star :grin:

Not about meeting matches GnV, it is about learning from others and there posting techniques.
wink

wink

Come on then... duel

duel

;-)

26 Sep 2012

Quote by GnV
see this mornings news bye bye then abu :wave: dont let the door bump ya arse on the way out

He'll probably call the border control people 'plebs' so he'll be re-arrested bolt

bolt

rotflmao

26 Sep 2012

Quote by starlightcouple

...Make your mind up!!

I have already.
As an aside have you been a member on here before?
rotflmao

rotflmao

No comment... ;-)
Sort of, yes. I was previously on here as "LB1" (on an account called LB2012) - we joined the site in April. But, in an attempt to encourage my wife to make use of the site more (which has so far been unsuccessful!), I created a second couples account and we re-branded as "Lilith" and "Inanna". I took this new account (created in July) and left the old account for my wife to use. Now, if only I could find a way to make her actually log on... :confused:
(and, just in case the reference to "wife" confuses anyone who hasn't read my profile... we're a lesbian married couple, but I'm bi) :-D

26 Sep 2012

Quote by GnV
Police officers are trained to deal with difficult people and diffuse difficult or take control of developing situations. That is their stock-in-trade.
It would appear from reports (hoist by their own petard comes to mind here) that this was not the case.
The officer appears too officious and over-reacted, unnecessarily inflaming the situation for his own dubious purposes.

Would you mind posting links to the exact reports you're talking about? I'm curious to know what you've read in order to come to that conclusion about the officer's behaviour. I've only read/heard rather vague reports...

Quote by GnV
On the other hand, an MP receives no such training and one should come to expect the very worst from them. Anything better than that is a bonus.

rotflmao

very well put!

Quote by GnV
As I said, a more experienced officer could have dealt with it quite differently and avoided the unnecessary public spat. He could then have been much more effective 'behind the scenes' in bringing the errant GCW to account and could have returned to the gate with a wry, but knowing smile.
There are many more ways of killing a cat than screwing its neck!

Perhaps, and I do see your point. You are right that there are other ways that it could have been handled. But, notwithstanding that the officer may be at fault also, I don't think that this justifies or somehow excuses Mr Mitchell's behaviour, and I still think it is absolutely right that he should hold his hands up and apologise (and be clear about what he is apologising for, as per flower's original comment in this thread). However, I suspect we are in agreement on that point anyway... ;-)

26 Sep 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
it has everything to do with his background. It also has everything to do with that privaledged background. I would expect a foul mouthed football yob to have behaved in this way, but certainly not a person in his political position.

Firstly, his political position is one thing; his background is an entirely different matter. I agree that a person in his political position should know better and should not have behaved in that way (as I have already said). I also agree that he should be held to a higher standard with regard to his public behaviour because he holds a public office and is in a position of influence and power. That position brings with it responsibilities. The subtlety that you appear to be missing is that I would expect the same of anyone in that office, regardless of their background or upbringing.
Secondly, I would argue that behaving abusively to police officers is unacceptable for anyone, regardless of their background. Do you disagree with that? Do you think that it is ok for a "football yob" to behave in that way, just because you may expect it from him? In my opinion, coming from an under-privileged background is not an excuse for anti-social behaviour. You seem to be suggesting that it is only the "privileged" who should be expected to behave with manners...?
Finally, I wonder whether you think that being born into privilege automatically results in a person being polite and well-mannered, and that (on the contrary), being born with a low socio-economic status automatically results in "yobs"?
I'm not sure what you think is so obvious about your point that everyone should see it...?
Also, while I'm writing...

Quote by starlightcouple
Your argument holds very little in the way of understanding his behavior.

AND

Quote by starlightcouple
Two wrongs never make a right, and to put ones self into another persons head, as to try and make some kind of excuse for their behavior or to try and understand their behavior , is i am sorry to say utter madness.

...Make your mind up!! :roll:

26 Sep 2012

You could try suggesting that you go to a swingers club, but not actually play with anyone else while you're there. There's nothing to stop you going to the club, watching others, and then going off on your own to a private room. The atmosphere and environment at the club is, in itself, a turn-on. It will also be very exciting and certainly add a bit of spice! And if she likes the idea of swinging, but doesn't want to actually try it yet, then this may be a good middle road for you both? After a while, she may decide that she does want to try it, and then you won't need to keep your membership of this site secret any more...

26 Sep 2012

Quote by GnV
@Lilith :thumbup:

lol

... you may like me less after reading my latest post! innocent

innocent

;-)

26 Sep 2012

Quote by GnV
the Police Officer concerned displayed an alarming lack of suitability to the assigned post. He doesn't have to be subservient, just display a better aptitude for dealing with difficult people.

Do you know something we don't? Unless you actually know exactly what happened and why, you do seem to be assuming rather a lot here...

Quote by GnV
He could have shown the true extent of his training and experience by diffusing the situation and avoiding conflict except that he chose to go about his duty like a bull in a china shop...

Again, do you know more than everyone else about what happened? For all we know, the officer did try to diffuse the situation... And, even if he did not, surely this goes both ways? Shouldn't Mr Mitchell also be expected to show some maturity?

26 Sep 2012

I wax, rather than shave, and ingrowns are more of a problem with waxing. Exfoliation is definitely key. I exfoliate every few days and then use "bush balm" (which I find a rather ironic name, since the balm is needed after removing the bush... dunno

dunno

)

26 Sep 2012

I'm genuinely at a loss as to what on earth class or privilege has to do with this?
Star - I find it surprising that you would make a comment like "what gives a silver spooned Tory toff born into money and privilege the right to behave in such a disgusting manner". Do you really think his background is at all relevant? What gives anyone, regardless of socio-economic status, the right to be abusive to a police officer? And a person in his position should certainly know better.
I really do think that talking about class and trying to turn this into an issue about his background or political views just detracts and distracts from the actual issue.

26 Sep 2012

Quote by Cubes
Oooh - can I have mail too, please, Cubey! :bounce:
:giggle:

Have you been on the Smarties again? :lol2:
If by "smarties" you meant "several glasses of champagne and half a bottle of wine", then yes... I had been on the smarties when I wrote that post!! lol

26 Sep 2012

Quote by Lizaleanrob
here in lies the rub I'm sorry but because someone was educated differently has a different job they should not and do not have different rights to you or me. We as adults should all be just as responsible for our behaviour in public being a mp should not carry different rules otherwise it becomes us that makes them elite and different to us, when in reality they are not .
at the moment i see nothing other than a Mexican stand off between the police and this mp. life can be very black and white or very grey, in other words if he swore or abused the police arrest him and get it done with if he didn't drop the whole thing, because at the moment its fastly becoming a lot of nothing and all very grey indeed

I actually said nothing about people having different "rights" based on their job or role within society; I was talking about responsibility and duty. But, since you've brought it up, I'll address that too. Frankly, I think it is rather naive to suggest that we are all the same. It is also wrong to assume that treating everyone the same = equality. For example, if women were treated exactly the same as men in the workplace, they would be given no paid maternity leave, which would result in inequities for women when trying to progress in their careers. That is just one example, but I could list a lot of other examples where the law grants different rights to different people based on a certain characteristic, or their position within society. The whole concept of "indirect" discrimination in the Equality Act is based on the idea that by applying the same rules to everyone, the result is to place people with a certain protected characteristic at a disadvantage.
Giving people different legal rights has nothing to do with "elitism" - in most cases, I'd say that the more vulnerable people or the minorities in society are protected (or at least sought to be protected) by these differences. It is a fact that people are different. Some are born into more privileged lifestyles, some are more naturally gifted with intelligence or some other ability. We are not all the same and it is important to recognise that and apply the "rules" accordingly in order to minimise the sort of elitism you're talking about and reduce the socio-economic divide.
Back on topic - again, I think it is wrong to hold everyone to the same standards. People in public office, with duties and responsibilities to the public, should be held to a higher standard with regard to their public behaviour. If he had shouted and cursed at some one who wasn't a police officer, there would be no legal issues in debate. But, I would still expect him to apologise publicly for that sort of behaviour. If you or I shouted and cursed at someone, it would not be a matter of public interest.

25 Sep 2012

Quote by Cubes
Does anyone know how come my photo doesn't show when i post? Its on my profile. Do i need to change something?

You've got mail. ;)
Oooh - can I have mail too, please, Cubey! :bounce:
:giggle:

25 Sep 2012

Quote by Lizaleanrob
this is more about who he is not what he said :dry:

Of course it is, and quite rightly so! He is in a position of responsibility as an elected representative. AND, given his role within Cabinet, he is also in a position of influence and authority. He chose this as his career, so he must accept that he cannot - like us "common folk" - have public outbursts like this without consequence. His title includes the word "Honourable"... He should try harder to live up to that!
Its not exactly a four letter foul mouthed full on rant is it, yes he is in a position of power and yes he should know better but this is just a slight slip of the cap
for me its nice to know we arn`t that different. If two jags can clump an egg throwing goon and walk away unscathed as he did then this really is nothing at all
It is not relevant how bad you consider what he said to be - that, in itself, is very much a matter of opinion - my point is simply that there are consequences to any action. When a person is in a position of responsibility, power and influence, those consequences are greater than they are for others. You may consider it nice to know that we aren't all that different, but that view doesn't detract from the reality that he is a person in public office, and he therefore has a responsibility and duty to be more careful with his behaviour in public.
Personally, I think it is rarely possible to justify abusive outbursts towards police officers (or anyone else who is simply doing their job), and it makes me sad that people think it is ok to be so rude based on the justification that "lots of people swear and shout at the police, so why shouldn't he". We should be starting from a position where people are expected to pay each other common courtesy (and to respect the rule of law), rather than the seemingly prevailing selfish attitude where people only care about their own "rights" and whatever suits them best.
I hasten to add that my views on this are not at all connected with any political persuasions I have - it is simply a matter of believing that in a civilised society, there is no place or justification for behaving so aggressively towards others. I believe that our legal system is heavily weighted against the police, who have to take great care to operate within the rule of law and face serious repercussions for corruption or abuse of the system. I consider that we have one of the most sophisticated and fair legal systems in the world and the police, as enforcers of that system, are an institution to be respected; particularly by those who are part of that very system.
I'm sure several of you will attempt to pigeonhole me into one or other political box on the back of this post, but you may be surprised if you do. I don't really subscribe to any political party and my views range from far left to far right (with the bulk sitting somewhere in between) on any given issue.

25 Sep 2012

Mids - I do agree broadly with what you say, but you may want to use slightly more up-to-date examples when making a point about the current Government and current legal system... There haven't been hangings in England since the 1960s. I also don't really understand the relevance of the example in this particular context... dunno

dunno

25 Sep 2012

Quote by Lizaleanrob
this is more about who he is not what he said :dry:

Of course it is, and quite rightly so! He is in a position of responsibility as an elected representative. AND, given his role within Cabinet, he is also in a position of influence and authority. He chose this as his career, so he must accept that he cannot - like us "common folk" - have public outbursts like this without consequence. His title includes the word "Honourable"... He should try harder to live up to that!

25 Sep 2012

Quote by neilinleeds
Did 2 days short of 3 months earlier in the year, fell off the wagon quite spectacularly

If giving it up were easy, then it wouldn't be something to be so proud of... And you should be very proud of yourself for climbing back on - not easy when you've fallen off. You can do it this time. :-) kiss

kiss

25 Sep 2012

I'm right-handed, but I've always (rather inexplicably) found something rather sexy about lefties...
flipa

flipa

24 Sep 2012

Quote by Trevaunance
When did I suddenly become the bad guy?
When threads break down into constant flaming that is no longer relevant to the thread itself they are usually locked. That's not my fault, it's down to the site administration.

You're not the bad guy!! It was a genuine apology... redface

redface

24 Sep 2012

Quote by starlightcouple
you have a bit to learn about this particular forum. Experts in every field from Quantum physics to forensic science, and everything in between. I am sure that as you have only been here for a couple of months, i am sure that you will soon get to grips with some of the posters ways and thoughts. :notes:

I'm not really sure I understand your point... I had assumed that a current affairs forum would be a platform to enable intelligent adults to discuss and debate differing opinions and views on various current issues. For me, the purpose of any sort of debate - whether over a pint at the pub, in a formal debating society, or via an online forum - is to pit my wits against someone with an opposing view (or watch others do this) in order to broaden my mind, understand issues from other peoples' perspectives, and sometimes adjust my own views as a result.
Unless I put forward sensible arguments, I have no hope of out-witting my opponent, convincing anyone to see things my way and therefore showing myself as someone whose opinions are worth listening to. That is why I said that your approach seemed to me to be an odd strategy... but perhaps I was mistaken in thinking that you were trying to engage in an intelligent debate here? Perhaps you aren't trying to convince anyone of your point of view and, instead, are just stirring the pot to see what reactions you can achieve...?
:taz:
One of the most enjoyable things for me when debating with someone - or watching others debate - is encountering a person who so eloquently and convincingly puts forward their argument that it entirely changes my mind on an issue. It is a rare pleasure, but I would have thought that anyone who enjoys a real debate would (like me) get as much pleasure from encountering someone who argues so well that it changes their views entirely, as they do from convincing others to see things their way. dunno

dunno

Anyway... I must apologise to Trev, as I have strayed even further from the original topic now!! :gagged:

24 Sep 2012

Yes - I know that a lot of members on the site go out in Birmingham often... That's why I was hoping some people would be able to recommend a few good bars and clubs. I went to Uni in Brum, so know it reasonably well, but that was 10 years ago, so I'm a bit out of date now!!

23 Sep 2012

Quote by starlightcouple

It does strike me though that this is precisely what is wrong with the world. The refusal to put yourself in the other guy's head for just a second, and acknowledge that there may just be other ways of looking at things. Much easier to parcel things up with convenient little labels on so we don't have to actually bother to think.

I shall bare that ridiculous statement in mind, when that very nice man who has murdered two police officers in cold blood next comes into court. I mean i shall try hard to put myself in that persons shoes for a second. Maybe a silly reply, but your way of looking at things is one of the reasons the world is as mad as the boston tea party.
Two wrongs never make a right, and to put ones self into another persons head, as to try and make some kind of excuse for their behavior or to try and understand their behavior , is i am sorry to say utter madness. rolleyes

rolleyes

Do you often seek to justify such a wild generalisation based on such a highly specific example? To suggest that there is never, ever any point in trying to understand a situation from another person's point of view, based entirely on the example of a man who shot two police officers in cold blood (which few would argue is a mindset worth trying to understand) seems to me to be a very odd debating strategy... dunno

dunno

23 Sep 2012

Quote by Trevaunance
Is there any chance that this thread might get back somewhere near the topic?

It looks like the answer to your question is a resounding "NO" <sigh>

23 Sep 2012

My baby sister and I are planning my other sister's hen party. The group is about 30 girls aged between 25-32. The plan is 2 nights away in Brum. I want to make sure we go to a good club, and I'd like to be able to sort it so we're on the guest list and don't have to queue (to make my sis feel all special!). She likes RnB / Hip hop music.
Does anyone have any good recommendations?
I'm also looking for somewhere good to go for drinks before the club, ideally where we can reserve an area. So, any bar suggestions would also be great!
Thank you!! :-)

23 Sep 2012

Quote by foxylady2209
I have one written on a USB stick but not printed and signed. I must do that, as it is inadmissible as it is. And I have (or they have) a decent amount coming if I die employed as my company has an excellent pension scheme.

Make sure you appoint an executor in the will and execute it as a deed (getting two people to witness your signature). And then make sure your loved ones know where it's kept! You should be fine without a solicitor if it's a straightforward will and it's unlikely that anyone will contest your wishes. But if you're doing anything unusual or cutting a close relative out of your will, I'd strongly recommend you take legal advice, as it's not uncommon for wills to be successfully contested. A good lawyer who knows his/her stuff ought to be able to draft it to avoid that and make sure your assets are distributed according to your wishes.

23 Sep 2012

Quote by anais
PS out of curiousity, does anyone know how probate works?? My Mum doesn't have a will and Im not sure what will happen....

I can answer the probate question... Bit dull though, so will PM you! And if you need a good lawyer to write your will, I can highly recommend a friend of mine - he's just been given an award as one of the top 35 private client lawyers aged under 35. :-)

23 Sep 2012

Quote by meat2pleaseu
I was told that my boobs are "superb"

A bold claim, so I had to check.......they have a point
Yep... They both have a point. They're called nipples! innocent

innocent

:giggle: