I saw this link on another thread and was impelled to write a new thread.
Staffs hope you didn’t mind me using your link!
I know of a few teenage hoodie wearing clan where I live, to strangers they look scary in their groups I have a friends son caught carrying a knife, luckily my son has never wished to be in their circle although these are his friends.
Have spoken to many of these lads and asked why they feel they need to be this way, and why hang about in groups at shopping centres. I asked them if they liked themselves 3 out of 4 said no, this saddened me, as I have asked my own son the same question and after much thought said “do you know what yes I do”.
The reasons I see are a lot have no self worth, see no future, the reasons they hang about shopping centres is in today’s society that is where a lot of teenage girls could be found.
In my day we were able at 15 to get a Saturday job by applying for a work permit by law.
We still were able to work out of sight on milk rounds, I worked in a café washing up, I loved it, I worked below the minimum wage but did I care no, I had independence was able to but clothes and records with the little bit of money I earned.
On leaving school we have proper apprentice ships for children that struggled at school where a trade would be taught, we had youth clubs to meet people of our own ages, parks that were safe and lido’s where the lifeguards would watch out for the children.
We have very few things left to be able to give these children a future to look forward to. There is no council housing, or affordable housing.
I would hate to be a teenager today, as I would feel what hope is there of a future.
Even if they get an education and go to university are they really going to be able to leave home and be self sufficient?
Plus they will have debts already from studies to pay back.
I believe it is a little doom if they do, doom if they don’t.
I blame the government in a big way for destroying what we had back then.
We all had hope!
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Shouldn’t we as a society look listen and learn?
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Sorry Minx but are you really saying kids of today have nothing to look forward too? 
Sorry but that is rubbish. Both of mrs777's kids are doing fine as are their friends. Her son is about to join the army and her Daughter is doing great at school.
She has a paper round...funny I had one of those too 40 years ago now. Funny that has not changed.
They have more opportunities now than they ever have had. Like everything in life you get out what you put in. We live in a society that has created a benefit culture and kids today, not all but a lot, see their perents have adopted that way of life...so they do too.
Both her kids go to a youth club every Friday with their mates. I used to hang around the ice rink on a Satrurday for girls...no difference just different place to hang around.
With respect I think when you was doing a Sat job there was no minimum wage? There are jobs out there for kids but you have to get off your arse and be bothered to do one.
When kids leave school now they ALL have a chance to go to college, and the clever ones can go to uni. Yes they will be saddled with debts but with a degree their chances of getting higher paid work is much higher...you dont get something for nothing in this life.
There may not be many council houses left but there are loads of Housing association homes that are affordable.
Talk about doom and gloom scaremongering Minxy. The only kids we know who have no hope for the future are the few who cannot be bothered to get up out of their pits of a morning. Blimey I cannot believe what I have read....no doubt people will lambast me but I think it is rubbish to suggest that kids have no future.
Sorry but that is rubbish. Both of mrs777's kids are doing fine as are their friends. Her son is about to join the army and her Daughter is doing great at school.
She has a paper round...funny I had one of those too 40 years ago now. Funny that has not changed.
They have more opportunities now than they ever have had. Like everything in life you get out what you put in. We live in a society that has created a benefit culture and kids today, not all but a lot, see their perents have adopted that way of life...so they do too.
Both her kids go to a youth club every Friday with their mates. I used to hang around the ice rink on a Satrurday for girls...no difference just different place to hang around.
With respect I think when you was doing a Sat job there was no minimum wage? There are jobs out there for kids but you have to get off your arse and be bothered to do one.
When kids leave school now they ALL have a chance to go to college, and the clever ones can go to uni. Yes they will be saddled with debts but with a degree their chances of getting higher paid work is much higher...you dont get something for nothing in this life.
There may not be many council houses left but there are loads of Housing association homes that are affordable.
Talk about doom and gloom scaremongering Minxy. The only kids we know who have no hope for the future are the few who cannot be bothered to get up out of their pits of a morning. Blimey I cannot believe what I have read....no doubt people will lambast me but I think it is rubbish to suggest that kids have no future.
I used this link on the thread about baby P.
It was used to illustrate the difference in attitudes where children are concerned, we've seen huge introspection and almost a collective guilt over the baby P case, then in the same time frame, something like this appears.
Where I wonder do children change from those deserving our utmost protection to "feral" "vermin" an "infestation" and "deserving to be shot"? Incidentally if you watch the small video included in the link, those are all terms which have been posted by members of the public on the major news sites in response to the "kids out of control" type of stories.
I know there is perhaps a huge difference between a beaten and abused toddler and a teenager who is perhaps going off the rails, but do they not deserve the same effort to save? They are legally both children, both perhaps will be changed forever by their experiences. One could say that one is innocent and the other perhaps not, but, today's damaged child is perhaps tomorrows damaged parent. A self perpetuating cycle of destruction?
I personally think and I hope I may have led others to see, that sometimes blame is not the way to deal most sucessfully with a problem, I do not see all round condemnation as the way to deal with todays youth, remember this survey did not ask about children who commit crime but all children.
It was used to illustrate the difference in attitudes where children are concerned, we've seen huge introspection and almost a collective guilt over the baby P case, then in the same time frame, something like this appears.
Where I wonder do children change from those deserving our utmost protection to "feral" "vermin" an "infestation" and "deserving to be shot"? Incidentally if you watch the small video included in the link, those are all terms which have been posted by members of the public on the major news sites in response to the "kids out of control" type of stories.
I know there is perhaps a huge difference between a beaten and abused toddler and a teenager who is perhaps going off the rails, but do they not deserve the same effort to save? They are legally both children, both perhaps will be changed forever by their experiences. One could say that one is innocent and the other perhaps not, but, today's damaged child is perhaps tomorrows damaged parent. A self perpetuating cycle of destruction?
I personally think and I hope I may have led others to see, that sometimes blame is not the way to deal most sucessfully with a problem, I do not see all round condemnation as the way to deal with todays youth, remember this survey did not ask about children who commit crime but all children.
Quote by The BBC article
The charity claimed that the attitudes revealed by its study reflected the results of the latest British Crime Survey.
These showed that people blamed children for up to half of all crime when in fact they were responsible for only 12% of criminal activity.
Quote by staffcple
I used this link on the thread about baby P.
It was used to illustrate the difference in attitudes where children are concerned, we've seen huge introspection and almost a collective guilt over the baby P case, then in the same time frame, something like this appears.
Where I wonder do children change from those deserving our utmost protection to "feral" "vermin" an "infestation" and "deserving to be shot"? Incidentally if you watch the small video included in the link, those are all terms which have been posted by members of the public on the major news sites in response to the "kids out of control" type of stories.
I know there is perhaps a huge difference between a beaten and abused toddler and a teenager who is perhaps going off the rails, but do they not deserve the same effort to save? They are legally both children, both perhaps will be changed forever by their experiences. One could say that one is innocent and the other perhaps not, but, today's damaged child is perhaps tomorrows damaged parent. A self perpetuating cycle of destruction?
I personally think and I hope I may have led others to see, that sometimes blame is not the way to deal most sucessfully with a problem, I do not see all round condemnation as the way to deal with todays youth, remember this survey did not ask about children who commit crime but all children.
The charity claimed that the attitudes revealed by its study reflected the results of the latest British Crime Survey.
These showed that people blamed children for up to half of all crime when in fact they were responsible for only 12% of criminal activity.
I understood why you put that link staffs, without you even explaining it, and it has shocked me greatly what I saw.
I feel all youth get treated the same, peoples tolerance levels have gone in my opinion, my children are good kids and brought up to show respect at all times. But they are twins of 12 and a 17 year old, twice now adults on buses have shown total lack of respect for my children which angers me, respect is a two way thing.
On one occasion my daughter was on a bus and was about to hand her seat to an elderly man that got on the bus, but just as she rose to let him sit down she had his walking stick poked in her face, and abuse given to her as he said she was young enough not to have been sitting down, there were no other people on the bus standing so she sat on a seat.
Another time they were going to board a bus when a woman pushed my 12 year old son almost to the floor and said let the adults get on first, they said they were the first at the bus stop so felt they should have boarded the bus first, they only started secondary school in September and there have been two incidences already. How can child give respect when they are being treated this way?
Quote by kentswingers777
Seems like a thread for threads sake. :shock:
No just can't be bothered to get into an arguement with you!
I do believe that teenagers as a whole get a bad press, I do believe a certain amount of respect has gone. But I dont believe all should be tarnished with the same brush.
That is that way a lot of todays society seems to be going. We just need to be careful.
People talk about kids of today as if they had nothing, and that everyone is against them.....not true.
This generation of kids have things I and my age group and above, could only ever have dreamed of. They have the Playstations and the wi's and the computer, Internet. They have opportunities to do things like foreign holidays as a norm. Still they seem to say they are bored...nothing to do.
The only thing different from now and when I was a kid is that old cookie.... RESPECT. For a lot of younsters they have none of that and no fear. They expect things to be handed to them on a plate.
As my Father has said many times...if ever there was a generation that should be " fuc-ed up, it is his. Like many of his age they were uprooted from their homes and evacuated during the second world war. Uprooted from their families to go sometimes hundreds of miles away. Their Fathers were not there as most were in the armed forces, but they still had respect.
Kids get a bad press because some..not all...are ferel little yobs. That's a fact. They lip you if you dare say anything to them at all. They have the upper hand now. Don't believe me? then ask a teacher or a police officer the kind of crap they have to put up with.
If kids want to be treated well then that is a two way street. If a kid shows me some respect then I return it. But if a ferel little yob wants to give me his " attitude ", then he will get it straight back.
You get out of life what you put into it and a lot of youngsters do not want to work at all. They are happy to hang around street corners and intimidate people. Luckily that is a small minority of kids, the majority are good kids from good families, who have taught them the thankyou and please words. The rest could not even spell them words.
This generation of kids have things I and my age group and above, could only ever have dreamed of. They have the Playstations and the wi's and the computer, Internet. They have opportunities to do things like foreign holidays as a norm. Still they seem to say they are bored...nothing to do.
The only thing different from now and when I was a kid is that old cookie.... RESPECT. For a lot of younsters they have none of that and no fear. They expect things to be handed to them on a plate.
As my Father has said many times...if ever there was a generation that should be " fuc-ed up, it is his. Like many of his age they were uprooted from their homes and evacuated during the second world war. Uprooted from their families to go sometimes hundreds of miles away. Their Fathers were not there as most were in the armed forces, but they still had respect.
Kids get a bad press because some..not all...are ferel little yobs. That's a fact. They lip you if you dare say anything to them at all. They have the upper hand now. Don't believe me? then ask a teacher or a police officer the kind of crap they have to put up with.
If kids want to be treated well then that is a two way street. If a kid shows me some respect then I return it. But if a ferel little yob wants to give me his " attitude ", then he will get it straight back.
You get out of life what you put into it and a lot of youngsters do not want to work at all. They are happy to hang around street corners and intimidate people. Luckily that is a small minority of kids, the majority are good kids from good families, who have taught them the thankyou and please words. The rest could not even spell them words.
People talk about kids of today as if they had nothing, and that everyone is against them.....not true.
You just said qoute" People talk about kids of today as if they had nothing, and that everyone is against them " Who are these people?
So how can you quote that then say not true?
This generation of kids have things I and my age group and above, could only ever have dreamed of. They have the Playstations and the wi's and the computer, Internet.
You say this as if it is a good thing.
One thing you missed if freedom, the freedom that we had to go out and not worry about being mugged or attacked.
They have opportunities to do things like foreign holidays as a norm. Still they seem to say they are bored...nothing to do.
I know a lot of kids that have never been abroad my children are three of them, my 17 year old has never been abroad.
I know of a lot of others too.
The only thing different from now and when I was a kid is that old cookie.... RESPECT. For a lot of younsters they have none of that and no fear. They expect things to be handed to them on a plate.
This I feel is the minority spoiling it for the majority.
As my Father has said many times...if ever there was a generation that should be " fuc-ed up, it is his. Like many of his age they were uprooted from their homes and evacuated during the second world war. Uprooted from their families to go sometimes hundreds of miles away. Their Fathers were not there as most were in the armed forces, but they still had respect
Do you ever feel when your kids go out a feeling of hoping they will be safe?
Do you worry about crime on the streets?
Is this what freedom out forebearers saw?
Is it no wonder that we entertain children at home with electrical gadets?
I don't have this mentally as I say I will worry if something happens, I don't want my kids to fear going out.
But I know a lot of kids that are scared to walk the streets, my friends son who I mentioned was caught with a knife, he carried it because he had been mugged 4 times before he was 17 and said he felt safer with it, he has decent parents, his parents were horrifed.
Kids get a bad press because some..not all...are ferel little yobs. That's a fact. They lip you if you dare say anything to them at all. They have the upper hand now. Don't believe me? then ask a teacher or a police officer the kind of crap they have to put up with.
I have asked teachers as I was very involved in my childrens primary school, and saw things with my own eyes, and yes you get the odd child that has lost total respect, but in general even the street kids as i called them, were not as bad as they appeared. A lot of it is a front as protection, the core of the child wasen't bad..
If kids want to be treated well then that is a two way street. If a kid shows me some respect then I return it. But if a ferel little yob wants to give me his " attitude ", then he will get it straight back.
What is a ferel kid in your eyes?
Is it one that might give you a bit of lip?
As these kids are nothing new, they were around when I was growing up.
You get out of life what you put into it and a lot of youngsters do not want to work at all.
Then let them work from a age they would like to.
A lot would want to start a saturday job like we did around 15. You can not even get a job in a supermarket these days filling selves without GCSE's You didn't need CSE's in my days to get a saturday job.
I say let them have a little independance at an earlier age, maybe then they might show work ethics and respect at an earlier age.
They are happy to hang around street corners and intimidate other people.
Didn't you ever hang around street corners?
Because I know I did in my youth.
Luckily that is a small minority of kids, the majority are good kids from good families, who have taught them the thankyou and please words.
There is more to respect than just please and thank you that is just basis manners
The rest could not even spell them words.
Well you have to look at the schooling for that!
well these are just my reponses to your points raised.
As you know we raise our children alike, but we can't just think about our owe children only in the wilder circle of life, a lot of kids havent been as fortunate to have been born to like minded parents, I can not shut my door and just think of my own here.
You just said qoute" People talk about kids of today as if they had nothing, and that everyone is against them " Who are these people?
So how can you quote that then say not true?
This generation of kids have things I and my age group and above, could only ever have dreamed of. They have the Playstations and the wi's and the computer, Internet.
You say this as if it is a good thing.
One thing you missed if freedom, the freedom that we had to go out and not worry about being mugged or attacked.
They have opportunities to do things like foreign holidays as a norm. Still they seem to say they are bored...nothing to do.
I know a lot of kids that have never been abroad my children are three of them, my 17 year old has never been abroad.
I know of a lot of others too.
The only thing different from now and when I was a kid is that old cookie.... RESPECT. For a lot of younsters they have none of that and no fear. They expect things to be handed to them on a plate.
This I feel is the minority spoiling it for the majority.
As my Father has said many times...if ever there was a generation that should be " fuc-ed up, it is his. Like many of his age they were uprooted from their homes and evacuated during the second world war. Uprooted from their families to go sometimes hundreds of miles away. Their Fathers were not there as most were in the armed forces, but they still had respect
Do you ever feel when your kids go out a feeling of hoping they will be safe?
Do you worry about crime on the streets?
Is this what freedom out forebearers saw?
Is it no wonder that we entertain children at home with electrical gadets?
I don't have this mentally as I say I will worry if something happens, I don't want my kids to fear going out.
But I know a lot of kids that are scared to walk the streets, my friends son who I mentioned was caught with a knife, he carried it because he had been mugged 4 times before he was 17 and said he felt safer with it, he has decent parents, his parents were horrifed.
Kids get a bad press because some..not all...are ferel little yobs. That's a fact. They lip you if you dare say anything to them at all. They have the upper hand now. Don't believe me? then ask a teacher or a police officer the kind of crap they have to put up with.
I have asked teachers as I was very involved in my childrens primary school, and saw things with my own eyes, and yes you get the odd child that has lost total respect, but in general even the street kids as i called them, were not as bad as they appeared. A lot of it is a front as protection, the core of the child wasen't bad..
If kids want to be treated well then that is a two way street. If a kid shows me some respect then I return it. But if a ferel little yob wants to give me his " attitude ", then he will get it straight back.
What is a ferel kid in your eyes?
Is it one that might give you a bit of lip?
As these kids are nothing new, they were around when I was growing up.
You get out of life what you put into it and a lot of youngsters do not want to work at all.
Then let them work from a age they would like to.
A lot would want to start a saturday job like we did around 15. You can not even get a job in a supermarket these days filling selves without GCSE's You didn't need CSE's in my days to get a saturday job.
I say let them have a little independance at an earlier age, maybe then they might show work ethics and respect at an earlier age.
They are happy to hang around street corners and intimidate other people.
Didn't you ever hang around street corners?
Because I know I did in my youth.
Luckily that is a small minority of kids, the majority are good kids from good families, who have taught them the thankyou and please words.
There is more to respect than just please and thank you that is just basis manners
The rest could not even spell them words.
Well you have to look at the schooling for that!
well these are just my reponses to your points raised.
As you know we raise our children alike, but we can't just think about our owe children only in the wilder circle of life, a lot of kids havent been as fortunate to have been born to like minded parents, I can not shut my door and just think of my own here.
Quote by kentswingers777
People talk about kids of today as if they had nothing, and that everyone is against them.....not true.
This generation of kids have things I and my age group and above, could only ever have dreamed of. They have the Playstations and the wi's and the computer, Internet. They have opportunities to do things like foreign holidays as a norm. Still they seem to say they are bored...nothing to do.
Ever think about what they may really need or want?
Do games consoles, foreign holidays, flash trainers and the latest mobile phone or Ipod come any where close to making up for parents and other responsible role model adults taking an interest in their lives instead of just buying their co-operation. What in your opinion is the best thing for a child to take an example from?
That for me is the major difference between now and then, society as a whole does not pay children any attention until they become a problem, ever thought that works in reverse and maybe, perhaps, one is driving the other?
Food for thought?
Quote by kentswingers777
Luckily that is a small minority of kids, the majority are good kids from good families, who have taught them the thankyou and please words.
The respect thing works both ways, like it or not, who offers or shows respect first should not matter, this is what the whole campaign is about for me,If it is a small minority why are adults unfairly and without evidence, grouping most if not all children as 'feral'.
It's the usual thing, all the hysteria with not much evidence to support it.
It's in black and white in the link, Children are responsible for 12% of crime. That leaves 88% that adults are responsible for.....who's the problem again?
Quote by staffcple
People talk about kids of today as if they had nothing, and that everyone is against them.....not true.
This generation of kids have things I and my age group and above, could only ever have dreamed of. They have the Playstations and the wi's and the computer, Internet. They have opportunities to do things like foreign holidays as a norm. Still they seem to say they are bored...nothing to do.
Ever think about what they may really need or want?
Do games consoles, foreign holidays, flash trainers and the latest mobile phone or Ipod come any where close to making up for parents and other responsible role model adults taking an interest in their lives instead of just buying their co-operation. What in your opinion is the best thing for a child to take an example from?
That for me is the major difference between now and then, society as a whole does not pay children any attention until they become a problem, ever thought that works in reverse and maybe, perhaps, one is driving the other?
Food for thought?
Quote by kentswingers777
Luckily that is a small minority of kids, the majority are good kids from good families, who have taught them the thankyou and please words.
The respect thing works both ways, like it or not, who offers or shows respect first should not matter, this is what the whole campaign is about for me,If it is a small minority why are adults unfairly and without evidence, grouping most if not all children as 'feral'.
It's the usual thing, all the hysteria with not much evidence to support it.
It's in black and white in the link, Children are responsible for 12% of crime. That leaves 88% that adults are responsible for.....who's the problem again?
A bit like the survey this thread relates too? 2021 adults fgs. :shock: I wonder where they took that survey? Was it near a council estate, or a posh suburb?
That ammount of people does not warant a survey is correct, for a survey to do that it should ask as many people from different backgrounds and cultures as possible. I wonder if they did that?
If you was to do a survey now...today....those same 2021 people would no doubt say that a child murdered, those responsible should be sacked, but I doubt if you would take that survey on board. A bit like I think that survey is rubbish...my opinion.
As for only 12% of minors doing crime, that I do not know how accurate that is. But children between the ages of 11 and 21 make up a very small part of society. Would you not agree. I wonder if in that catagory of ages if they equate to 12% of the population?
As for buying a childs co-operation, that would be a waste of money and a form of emotional blackmail. Kids are just that kids, and of course as adults we should make sure they have a good upbringing. But that does not mean bending over backwards for them to the detriment of a parent or any other adult. Respect is like trust...it has to be earned and not given as a right.
Honestly,
I don't believe any survey I read, in my experience surveys like statistics are far too easily manipulated to be of any use whatsoever, besides the fact that if a survey doesn't show what the commisioning body wants it to, you can rest assured it will never see the light of day. Unless you ask every single person resident in this country their opinion it can never be a fully representative set of results.
I just saw it as an interesting contradiction with the current fury over the baby P case, that another unrelated 'measure of public opinion' showed such a disturbing result.
The 12% figure comes from the British Crime Survey, the same figures the government uses to measure crime.
I couldn't find any figures on what percentage of population that age range represents so I'm content to concede that point.
I agree with your thoughts about buying co-operation, however that doesn't mean lots and lots of parents don't do it, both parents work, child left to own devices with electrical equipment as a baby sitter. As I said, if a childs example is games, tv and music, what do we really expect.
I'm not saying bending over backwards is the way to go, that will not work either, a mixture of love and discipline works best for me.
I just don't agree that respect and trust 'always' have to be earned, that i fear is something we won't agree on, but i will say, if you never show a child respect or trust first, how do they learn what it is?
I don't believe any survey I read, in my experience surveys like statistics are far too easily manipulated to be of any use whatsoever, besides the fact that if a survey doesn't show what the commisioning body wants it to, you can rest assured it will never see the light of day. Unless you ask every single person resident in this country their opinion it can never be a fully representative set of results.
I just saw it as an interesting contradiction with the current fury over the baby P case, that another unrelated 'measure of public opinion' showed such a disturbing result.
The 12% figure comes from the British Crime Survey, the same figures the government uses to measure crime.
I couldn't find any figures on what percentage of population that age range represents so I'm content to concede that point.
I agree with your thoughts about buying co-operation, however that doesn't mean lots and lots of parents don't do it, both parents work, child left to own devices with electrical equipment as a baby sitter. As I said, if a childs example is games, tv and music, what do we really expect.
I'm not saying bending over backwards is the way to go, that will not work either, a mixture of love and discipline works best for me.
I just don't agree that respect and trust 'always' have to be earned, that i fear is something we won't agree on, but i will say, if you never show a child respect or trust first, how do they learn what it is?
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
Sex God
Quote by kentswingers777
still believe trust and respect have to be earned Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
Respect and trust should be the starting point at how we approach people. Thats how we obtain civility and understanding. If we had to earn respect and trust off all we met and dealt with rather than show them respect and trust at the outset life would be sh*te I would rather say that disrespect and mistrust are earned in my world.
Sex God
Over heard not so long ago on the local shopping precinct.....
youth 1 "what we going to do then ?"
youth 2 " I don't know but I'm not hanging round here having everyone looking at us like scum"
thought it spoke volumes
youth 1 "what we going to do then ?"
youth 2 " I don't know but I'm not hanging round here having everyone looking at us like scum"
thought it spoke volumes
Quote by kentswingers777
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
In purely material terms, I'd agree, the majority of children do ok out of life, but....
Emotionally?
Nurture?
Being taught responsibility?
I don't know so much. Partially down to today's society, the blame culture and the abdication of responsibility by some parents.
I'd actually agree with Minxy, it appears in some ways children are damned before they do anything, feral until proven otherwise? Is that what we want? Is that the best thing for them?
Staggerlee's post said it all for me, If children think that's how people view them, without any evidence to the contrary, without any engagement whatsoever, just pre judged as 'scum' is it any surprise when they live up to it?
The kids probably had their hoodies on.
Our local shopping centre is Bluewater, up until recently the largest in Europe. They were the first and as far as I know, the only shopping centre that banned the use of kids hoods in the precinct, and a ban on any more than 4 or 5 kids loitering. I wonder why that was?
According to the shopkeepers they were intimidating other shoppers, and being generally menacing in their attitude and approach....their words not mine. They were deliberatly hiding their faces with their hoods to stop from being recognised as they were stealing from shops.
It was a huge problem and they done something about is far less intimidating now than it was. Not for me but for female shoppers and female staff. They may well get a bad press but.....lets be fair a lot of them bring it on themselves.
I suppose it is a myth that gang warfare is not happening out there on our streets? It is a fact from the Met police that inner london cities are rife with gangs..armed with both guns and knives, or are the media making that one up too?
Our local shopping centre is Bluewater, up until recently the largest in Europe. They were the first and as far as I know, the only shopping centre that banned the use of kids hoods in the precinct, and a ban on any more than 4 or 5 kids loitering. I wonder why that was?
According to the shopkeepers they were intimidating other shoppers, and being generally menacing in their attitude and approach....their words not mine. They were deliberatly hiding their faces with their hoods to stop from being recognised as they were stealing from shops.
It was a huge problem and they done something about is far less intimidating now than it was. Not for me but for female shoppers and female staff. They may well get a bad press but.....lets be fair a lot of them bring it on themselves.
I suppose it is a myth that gang warfare is not happening out there on our streets? It is a fact from the Met police that inner london cities are rife with gangs..armed with both guns and knives, or are the media making that one up too?
Kent,
You really have to look beyond what you read.
I'm not for one second saying all kids are innocent, that would be foolish and without truth. Some and i will quantify it as a tiny, tiny minority are beyond control and in all probability beyond help, exactly the same as their adult counterparts.
The whole link is about children as a group of beings being demonised, not because they had done anything wrong but due to peoples perception. What drives this perception? Do you for one second believe every one of the 2000+ people questioned has been a victim of a gang of feral youths?
Face it.....most of them in all probability read it in a paper or saw it on the news.
Gang warfare?
Not a myth at all, I have some personal experience of this, it's there alright, mainly in the major metropolitan areas such as London, Birmingham and Liverpool, most if not all of the violence and attacks are gang on gang, innocent bystanders don't tend to get involved because it's mainly about control of the street trades.
But it's not half as regular as the media will have you believe.
Do you see the pattern in the way the media works yet? One high profile case leads to almost blanket reporting of related and similar cases, fuelling public fear and driving attitudes like the one seen in this survey. Only to be dropped like a stone when the next 'big' story comes along.
By the way, have you seen 'Gaunty' has been sacked, go figure huh?
You really have to look beyond what you read.
I'm not for one second saying all kids are innocent, that would be foolish and without truth. Some and i will quantify it as a tiny, tiny minority are beyond control and in all probability beyond help, exactly the same as their adult counterparts.
The whole link is about children as a group of beings being demonised, not because they had done anything wrong but due to peoples perception. What drives this perception? Do you for one second believe every one of the 2000+ people questioned has been a victim of a gang of feral youths?
Face it.....most of them in all probability read it in a paper or saw it on the news.
Gang warfare?
Not a myth at all, I have some personal experience of this, it's there alright, mainly in the major metropolitan areas such as London, Birmingham and Liverpool, most if not all of the violence and attacks are gang on gang, innocent bystanders don't tend to get involved because it's mainly about control of the street trades.
But it's not half as regular as the media will have you believe.
Quote by Your link
When violence erupts, it gains a high profile in the press.
Do you see the pattern in the way the media works yet? One high profile case leads to almost blanket reporting of related and similar cases, fuelling public fear and driving attitudes like the one seen in this survey. Only to be dropped like a stone when the next 'big' story comes along.
By the way, have you seen 'Gaunty' has been sacked, go figure huh?
Quote by staffcple
Kent,
You really have to look beyond what you read.
I'm not for one second saying all kids are innocent, that would be foolish and without truth. Some and i will quantify it as a tiny, tiny minority are beyond control and in all probability beyond help, exactly the same as their adult counterparts.
The whole link is about children as a group of beings being demonised, not because they had done anything wrong but due to peoples perception. What drives this perception? Do you for one second believe every one of the 2000+ people questioned has been a victim of a gang of feral youths?
Face it.....most of them in all probability read it in a paper or saw it on the news.
Gang warfare?
Not a myth at all, I have some personal experience of this, it's there alright, mainly in the major metropolitan areas such as London, Birmingham and Liverpool, most if not all of the violence and attacks are gang on gang, innocent bystanders don't tend to get involved because it's mainly about control of the street trades.
But it's not half as regular as the media will have you believe.
When violence erupts, it gains a high profile in the press.
Do you see the pattern in the way the media works yet? One high profile case leads to almost blanket reporting of related and similar cases, fuelling public fear and driving attitudes like the one seen in this survey. Only to be dropped like a stone when the next 'big' story comes along.
By the way, have you seen 'Gaunty' has been sacked, go figure huh?
That is pure speculation and of course an opinion, you do not know that for sure, even though you said " probably " that does seem to be your thought pattern.
Some people have a hatred of the media, and whilst I know they can be " economical " with the truth, I would rather have them than not.
Sorry but from what I have seen and heard and read, the ferel yobs are not quite the minority you seem to portray. Most kids nowadays have an attitude problem, of course some are worse than others, but the attitude is there.
My Father lives on a large housing estate and has been told to fuc-off many times by 6 year olds, because he dared to ask them not to kick their ball against his fence.
Sorry but I wonder why adults perceptions of the youth of today is so low. Are you really saying it is all without substance, and they have those attitudes towards the youth, just because of what they read? Sorry but go onto most street corners tonight and see the ferel lurking, and intimidating....its happening now just up the road from me every night, and probably on every street corner of those who are reading this thread. I wonder how many people now would walk the streets after nine at night? Certainly a few would not.
Quote by kentswingers777
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
I always annoy you thats what I am good at!
As you always feel I never talk sence anyway!
Also I can insinuate what I like as it is my opinion, but as I said my opinion always annoys you anyway, so there is no change there
I am no guardian angel in another life or this, but I do like young people. But then I have given up my time voluntary to get among them, and even the kids I was told were trouble, are not trouble and no different from some around in my day at heart.
You give anyone a label and they hear it enough, they will start to live up to that label in the end.
Staffs again I must say I like your postings in this thread. :thumbup:
Quote by Theladyisaminx
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
I always annoy you thats what I am good at!
As you always feel I never talk sence anyway!
Also I can insinuate what I like as it is my opinion, but as I said my opinion always annoys you anyway, so there is no change there
I am no guardian angel in another life or this, but I do like young people. But then I have given up my time voluntary to get among them, and even the kids I was told were trouble, are not trouble and no different from some around in my day at heart.
You give anyone a label and they hear it enough, they will start to live up to that label in the end.
Staffs again I must say I like your postings in this thread. :thumbup:
Well if you have so much faith in the young,what about tom night having a wander around Lewisham after say 9 at night. Am sure you will meet some lovely youngsters, but of course they will be missunderstood............won't they? :shock:
Quote by kentswingers777
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
I always annoy you thats what I am good at!
As you always feel I never talk sence anyway!
Also I can insinuate what I like as it is my opinion, but as I said my opinion always annoys you anyway, so there is no change there
I am no guardian angel in another life or this, but I do like young people. But then I have given up my time voluntary to get among them, and even the kids I was told were trouble, are not trouble and no different from some around in my day at heart.
You give anyone a label and they hear it enough, they will start to live up to that label in the end.
Staffs again I must say I like your postings in this thread. :thumbup:
Well if you have so much faith in the young,what about tom night having a wander around Lewisham after say 9 at night. Am sure you will meet some lovely youngsters, but of course they will be missunderstood............won't they? :shock:
I think you forget I live in the borough of lewisham. I get trains from London bridge of a night sometimes and walk the streets around here after nine. As do friends of mine, I havent seen kids hanging about on the street corners here. Actually if you came to where I live you cant hear a thing only trains. But thats why I like living here and have been here 18 years
Quote by Theladyisaminx
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
I always annoy you thats what I am good at!
As you always feel I never talk sence anyway!
Also I can insinuate what I like as it is my opinion, but as I said my opinion always annoys you anyway, so there is no change there
I am no guardian angel in another life or this, but I do like young people. But then I have given up my time voluntary to get among them, and even the kids I was told were trouble, are not trouble and no different from some around in my day at heart.
You give anyone a label and they hear it enough, they will start to live up to that label in the end.
Staffs again I must say I like your postings in this thread. :thumbup:
Well if you have so much faith in the young,what about tom night having a wander around Lewisham after say 9 at night. Am sure you will meet some lovely youngsters, but of course they will be missunderstood............won't they? :shock:
I think you forget I live in the borough of lewisham. I get trains from London bridge of a night sometimes and walk the streets around here after nine. As do friends of mine, I havent seen kids hanging about on the street corners here. Actually if you came to where I live you cant hear a thing only trains. But thats why I like living here and have been here 18 years
With respect your hardly likely to say otherwise....are you?
My ex mother in law lives in Catford and I know what that and Lewisham is like.....just up the road from New Cross...need I say more?
Next you will say Peckham and Lee Green are ok too. :shock:
Looks like Lewisham has a higher than average crime rate?
Quote by kentswingers777
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
I always annoy you thats what I am good at!
As you always feel I never talk sence anyway!
Also I can insinuate what I like as it is my opinion, but as I said my opinion always annoys you anyway, so there is no change there
I am no guardian angel in another life or this, but I do like young people. But then I have given up my time voluntary to get among them, and even the kids I was told were trouble, are not trouble and no different from some around in my day at heart.
You give anyone a label and they hear it enough, they will start to live up to that label in the end.
Staffs again I must say I like your postings in this thread. :thumbup:
Well if you have so much faith in the young,what about tom night having a wander around Lewisham after say 9 at night. Am sure you will meet some lovely youngsters, but of course they will be missunderstood............won't they? :shock:
I think you forget I live in the borough of lewisham. I get trains from London bridge of a night sometimes and walk the streets around here after nine. As do friends of mine, I havent seen kids hanging about on the street corners here. Actually if you came to where I live you cant hear a thing only trains. But thats why I like living here and have been here 18 years
With respect your hardly likely to say otherwise....are you?
My ex mother in law lives in Catford and I know what that and Lewisham is like.....just up the road from New Cross...need I say more?
Next you will say Peckham and Lee Green are ok too. :shock:
Looks like Lewisham has a higher than average crime rate?
So what does that prove?
That you live in a better area than I
I can only say what I see with my own eyes or hear the word on the street so to speak.
Sex God
I think that its tough being a kid nowadays. I think there is more pressure on them to succeed at a younger age and that a lot get to a point where they see no advantage in trying anymore. As for the electronic gadgetry et al that just helps provide less incentive in the end. The consumer society together with the over protection does nothing to help. I think its tougher to be a teen than ever before. More choices is not necessarily a good thing it can be a directionless burden.
Oh, and for what its worth, I think some kids regardless of background are just mindless shits who turn out to be mindless shit adults.
Oh, and for what its worth, I think some kids regardless of background are just mindless shits who turn out to be mindless shit adults.
Sex God
Quote by TheladyisaminxBlah
Blah de blah
blah de blah de blah
blah de blah de blah de blah
blah blah de blah de blah de blah
A game of quotey quotey anyone
Quote by Theladyisaminx
I still believe trust and respect have to be earned. Of course parents should teach their kids those things, as a matter of course.
What annoyed me about this thread is that the op was insinuating that kids are " hard done by ". They in my opinion have never had it so good.
Sometimes I think Minxy was a Guardian Angel in a previous life.
An interesting read this one.
I always annoy you thats what I am good at!
As you always feel I never talk sence anyway!
Also I can insinuate what I like as it is my opinion, but as I said my opinion always annoys you anyway, so there is no change there
I am no guardian angel in another life or this, but I do like young people. But then I have given up my time voluntary to get among them, and even the kids I was told were trouble, are not trouble and no different from some around in my day at heart.
You give anyone a label and they hear it enough, they will start to live up to that label in the end.
Staffs again I must say I like your postings in this thread. :thumbup:
Well if you have so much faith in the young,what about tom night having a wander around Lewisham after say 9 at night. Am sure you will meet some lovely youngsters, but of course they will be missunderstood............won't they? :shock:
I think you forget I live in the borough of lewisham. I get trains from London bridge of a night sometimes and walk the streets around here after nine. As do friends of mine, I havent seen kids hanging about on the street corners here. Actually if you came to where I live you cant hear a thing only trains. But thats why I like living here and have been here 18 years
With respect your hardly likely to say otherwise....are you?
My ex mother in law lives in Catford and I know what that and Lewisham is like.....just up the road from New Cross...need I say more?
Next you will say Peckham and Lee Green are ok too. :shock:
Looks like Lewisham has a higher than average crime rate?
So what does that prove?
That you live in a better area than I
I can only say what I see with my own eyes or hear the word on the street so to speak.
It proves that your statement is without foundation.
Your crime rates in your area is a lot higher then the national average, which means you are more likely to be robbed..check the figures. But you said that it was as safe as houses of a night, well the stats show something much different.
But then after starting a thread saying kids are hard done by, you are hardly likely to say otherwise, even when shown any proof to the contrary.
That for me is my final thoughts on this thread. Pm me if you want to chat further Minx.x
